Monday, February 21, 2011

Denethor's Trap: "Becoming your enemy is not the way to win."

Honourable Means, writing at The Bonnie Blue Blog posts and comments upon CS Lewis' Review of "The Fellowship of the Ring" by JRR Tolkien.

It is well timed, to my mind, and he explains --

I posted this here for a few reasons:

1. I love Tolkien and CS Lewis, and find their works "ennobling", inspiring, and spiritually uplifting.

2. I celebrate individual works of great achievement: Tolkien's Lord of the Rings trilogy and the Silmarillion constitute one man's "lifeblood" -- the sum total of a massive synthesis of imagination and scholarship sustained and created over (literally) 60 years of effort. His books: The Hobbit, The Fellowship of the Ring, The Two Towers, the Return of the King, and The Silmarillion are the most impressive work of fiction of which I am aware (includes Frank Herbert's Dune; I'm sure you can think of others).

He succeeded in what he consciously set out to do:

“set myself a task, the arrogance of which I fully recognized and trembled at: being precisely to restore to the English an epic tradition and present them with a mythology of their own.”

He started writing the original tales or notes for tales in the trenches of France during the First World War, and the Silmarillion was published in 1977, four years after his death.

3. There have been setbacks and ups and downs in the patriot blogosphere of late.

One very big up is the excellent job that David Codrea and Mike Vanderbeogh have done on the Project Gunwalker scandal.

On the other hand, some posts lately have spoken of burnout or frustration at our apparent lack of numbers, or the apparent futility of our efforts.

What Tolkien described in his works about the end of the Third Age of Middle-Earth applies to our era as well:

“there was sorrow then too, and gathering dark, but great valour, and great deeds that were not wholly vain.”

Somehow, I feel that the efforts of the patriot blogosphere are like what Lewis said of the quests and efforts of the heroes of the Tolkien story:

"Not wholly vain -- it is the cool middle point between illusion and disillusionment."

"Some posts lately have spoken of burnout or frustration at our apparent lack of numbers, or the apparent futility of our efforts."

I can't help but think that maybe he was thinking of this post by Pete at Western Rifles Shooters (who posts under the name of Concerned American) which I must confess disturbed me more than a little when I read it.

Having been completely enmeshed in Gunwalker and other related issues as well as Absolved, I couldn't take the time to respond, but it bothered me greatly. I have had my share of honest differences of opinion with Pete of late, so I forwarded the link to a mutual friend and asked him to give me his thoughts on it to see if it bothered him as much as it bothered me. I still don't have time to respond to Pete, but I think Rick here has said it all for me.


Rick responded thusly:

Denethor’s Trap

Becoming your enemy is not the way to win. When I read this, I immediately thought of the scene in J.R.R Tolkien’s Return of the King wherein Denethor rues that Faramir has allowed Frodo to head for the Morgul Vale – and not brought the Ring of Power back to Minas Tirith. Gandalf, rightly discerning the Steward of Gondor’s character, challenges Denethor’s criticism of Faramir’s choice. [See excerpt following commentary.]

I think CA’s Friday, 18 February, 2011 post is a reflection of his personal frustration regarding the potential for restoration - which doesn’t mean that he is wrong in his observations and impressions (“… the good guys are deeply and perhaps irretrievably disadvantaged by their own rule-set”), although I think perhaps this assertion is over-stated.

I do think he is wrong in his conclusion (or at least my understanding of his conclusion). “Our gang” cannot afford to adopt the relativistic tactics of our enemy. Doing so has gotten us where we are today. Team Restoration must maintain the duality of principled Christian morality necessarily coupled with the tenets of British constitutionalism (inherent self-worth of the individual; legitimate government is a servant of the public good, not that master of its people; government’s powers and authority are limited, subject to the Higher Law of a Sovereign God) -- as these are the essential core of this uniquely American experiment in ordered Liberty. The Constitution’s republican forms cannot be divorced from the distinctly Judeo-Christian principles of natural law espoused in the Declaration of Independence. “Our gang” needs to understand this and put such principles into operation to combat our statist enemies’ machinations. And yes, even to hold firm against the underlying amoral social-contract rationale of many of our libertarian, ‘neo-conservative’ or agnostic Team Restoration co-belligerents…

(Notwithstanding Billy Beck’s accurate assessment that this present “conflict in American politics is individualism vs. collectivism in all its pretense forms and manifestation.” – the underlying premises of the individualist position are important to the restoration…)

CA falls into Denethor’s Trap. I do not blame him; I am prone to the same conclusions. Remembering that there is a higher purpose to History is the only thing that keeps me from despair. We do what we ought; we do what we must, regardless -- the end-game of history is written despite our efforts. Even if the glory that was the West goes down to utter ruin (as part of Almighty God’s master plan for the end times), we cannot, if we are to be true to our God and to our duty, true to America’s promise of ordered liberty and to our free heritage, do anything less. Yet in being true to our principled heritage we cannot fall into the tactics or adopt the unprincipled stance of our opponents.

I am concerned that CA, and others sharing his frustration, are advocating that direct actions be taken by Team Restoration – before the necessary breaches of the peace can legitimatize such actions … Yet see my response to his “We’re losing, Mike” comment in the post below. We have never been closer to awakening that remnant of actual Americans; we are still not past Ms. Wolf’s “awkward time.”

But if “our gang” loses these underlying Judeo-Christian moral principles; coupled with the limiting ideas of British Constitutionalism - if we become like our enemy - we hasten the endarkenment; we do not prevent it or overcome it.

Tactical patience, study, practice, and recruiting are the watchwords of the day.

Despair and internecine fighting are not.

Team Restoration needs disciplined leadership; its leaders and advocates need self-reinforcing support.

It is time for a long-weekend retreat to recharge each man’s soul, agree on core principles and develop lines of action for future endeavors.

Else we fall into error or despair and our opponents win.

And given the course of history, they may still ‘win” – but only for a season. And after that, comes the final judgment.


Appended is this "Excerpts of despair" from earlier email exchanges between the three of us.

… and from my 17 January comment regarding CA’s response to K”

“We're losing, Mike. [I really want Pete to explain this, in detail – no waffling. Why are we losing? Says who? In what context? And while it may not be because of Kerodin, Pete and David better understand why Kerodin is dangerous to the necessity of expanding the legitimacy of a constitutional restoration through armed resistance to overt tyranny. But until that awkward time has ended, I think Pete is unduly pessimistic on our chances for limited constitutional reform. The mood of the country has changed. Consider the impact of the Tea Party. Granted 30-40% the electorate (defined as those who minimally bother to pay attention to politics, as opposed to the great unwashed who can’t be bothered to even know which party holds the House vs. Senate vs. White House), are ‘liberals’ in the sense of statist-progressives, and are therefore almost certainly not recoverable, 60-70% the country are still traditional Americans. Bureaucratized, overweening government tyranny, the inevitable, inescapable affects the coming debt-bomb and/or currency collapse notwithstanding, we are closer than ever before in the last 50 years, to actual Americans waking up to the problem of too much government.]”


“Come up with a way that the Resistance can be something more than a paper tiger -- for despite protests to the contrary, that is how it is perceived by the few that knows it exists. [One of the main points of Kerodin’s writings, and one of Pete’s biggest concerns, is that the restoration project is a paper tiger, that there are too few who understand, and even among those who understand, who are morally courageous enough to act, if and when that time comes… I think this is the core reason Pete disagrees with you regarding Kerodin. Pete sees some value in Kerodin’s underlying theme. Kerodin’s writings exude the same visceral frustration – that all the writing and passion on the internet are just posturing; that there is no moral courage to act. ]”

also, other referenced link:

"I keep saying it: the basic conflict in American politics is individualism vs. collectivism in all its pretense forms and manifestation. I keep saying it because no arrangements of coalition electoral politics will address this fundamental schism: as the necessary economic implications become real, so-called 'democracy' becomes impotent to manage coalition demands, all while the force of 'law' becomes more arbitrary at coalition demand.

"I've been saying it for at least fifteen years: "The pace of this thing is picking up."

"I hate to keep saying it, because I know it's no fun to hear it and it just wears my narrow white ass out to keep-ass saying it, but the real problem under all this is fucking enormous

"I really don't think it can be fixed before it really goes the way of the pear. We're really in it. In our lifetimes."

Billy Beck, Two-Four - What Really Happened

Excerpt J.R.R. Tolkien’s Lord of the Rings

“… a captain reporting to his master such matters as had often been heard before, small things of border-war that now seemed useless and petty, shorn of their renown.

Then suddenly Faramir looked at Pippin. 'But now we come to strange matters,' he said. 'For this is not the first halfling that I have seen walking out of northern legends into the Southlands.'

At that Gandalf sat up and gripped the arms of his chair; but he said nothing, and with a look stopped the exclamation on Pippin’s lips. Denethor looked at their faces and nodded his head, as though in sign that he had read much there before it was spoken. Slowly, while the others sat silent and still, Faramir told his tale, with his eyes for the most part on Gandalf, though now and again his glance strayed to Pippin, as if to refresh his memory of others he had seen.

As his story was unfolded of his meeting with Frodo and his servant and of the events of the Henneth Annun, Pippin became aware that Gandalf’s hands were trembling as they clutched the carven wood. White they seemed now and very old, and as he looked at them, suddenly with a thrill of fear Pippin knew that Gandalf, even Gandalf himself, was troubled, even afraid. The air of the room was close and still. At last when Faramir spoke of his parting with the travelers, and of their resolve to go to Cirith Ungol, his voice fell, and he shook his head and sighed. Then Gandalf sprang up.

‘Cirith Ungol? Morgul Vale?’ he said. ‘The time, Faramir, the time? When did you part with them? When would they reach that accursed valley?’

‘I parted with them in the morning two days ago,” said Faramir. ‘It is fifteen leagues thence to the vale of the Morgulduin, if they went straight south; and then they would be still five leagues westward of the accursed Tower. At swiftest they could not come there before today, and maybe they have not come there yet. Indded I see what you fear. But the darkness is not due to their venture. It began yestereve, and all Ithilien was under shadow last night. It is clear to me that the Enemy has long planned an assault on us, and its hour had already been determined before ever the travelers left my keeping.’

Gandalf paced the floor. ‘The morning of two days ago, nigh on three days of journey! How far is the place, where you parted?’

'Some twenty-five leagues as a bird flies,' answered Faramir. 'But I could not come more swiftly. Yestereve I lay at Cair Andros, the long isle in the River northward which we hold in defence; and horses are kept on the hither bank. As the dark drew on I knew that haste was needed, so I rode thence with three others that could also be horsed. The rest of my company I sent south to strengthen the garrison at the fords of Osgiliath. I hope that I have not done ill?' He looked at his father.

'Ill?' cried Denethor, and his eyes flashed suddenly. 'Why do you ask? The men were under your command. Or do you ask for my judgement on all your deeds? Your bearing is lowly in my presence, yet it is long now since you turned from your own way at my counsel. See, you have spoken skilfully, as ever; but I, have I not seen your eye fixed on Mithrandir, seeking whether you said well or too much? He has long had your heart in his keeping.

'My son, your father is old but not yet dotard. I can see and hear, as was my wont; and little of what you have half said or left unsaid is now hidden from me. I know the answer to many riddles. Alas, alas for Boromir!'

'If what I have done displeases you, my father,' said Faramir quietly, 'I wish I had known your counsel before the burden of so weighty a judgement was thrust on me.'

'Would that have availed to change your judgement?' said Denethor. 'You would still have done just so, I deem. I know you well. Ever your desire is to appear lordly and generous as a king of old, gracious, gentle. That may well befit one of high race, if he sits in power and peace. But in desperate hours gentleness may be repaid with death.'

'So be it,' said Faramir.

'So be it!' cried Denethor. 'But not with your death only, Lord Faramir: with the death also of your father, and of all your people, whom it is your part to protect now that Boromir is gone.'

'Do you wish then,' said Faramir, 'that our places had been exchanged?'

'Yes, I wish that indeed,' said Denethor. 'For Boromir was loyal to me and no wizard's pupil. He would have remembered his father's need, and would not have squandered what fortune gave. He would have brought me a mighty gift.'

For a moment Faramir's restraint gave way. 'I would ask you, my father, to remember why it was that I, not he, was in Ithilien. On one occasion at least your counsel has prevailed, not long ago. It was the Lord of the City that gave the errand to him.'

'Stir not the bitterness in the cup that I mixed for myself,' said Denethor. 'Have I not tasted it now many nights upon my tongue foreboding that worse yet lay in the dregs? As now indeed I find. Would it were not so! Would that this thing had come to me!'

'Comfort yourself!' said Gandalf. 'In no case would Boromir have brought it to you. He is dead, and died well; may he sleep in peace! Yet you deceive yourself. He would have stretched out his hand to this thing, and taking it he would have fallen. He would have kept it for his own, and when he returned you would not have known your son.'

The face of Denethor set hard and cold. 'You found Boromir less apt to your hand, did you not?' he said softly. 'But I who was his father say that he would have brought it to me. You are wise, maybe, Mithrandir, yet with all your subtleties you have not all wisdom. Counsels may be found that are neither the webs of wizards nor the haste of fools. I have in this matter more lore and wisdom than you deem. '

'What then is your wisdom?' said Gandalf.

'Enough to perceive that there are two follies to avoid. To use this thing is perilous. At this hour, to send it in the hands of a witless halfling into the land of the Enemy himself, as you have done, and this son of mine, that is madness.'

'And the Lord Denethor what would he have done?'

'Neither. But most surely not for any argument would he have set this thing at a hazard beyond all but a fool's hope, risking our utter ruin, if the Enemy should recover what he lost. Nay, it should have been kept, hidden, hidden dark and deep. Not used, I say, unless at the uttermost end of need, but set beyond his grasp, save by a victory so final that what then befell would not trouble us, being dead.'

'You think, as is your wont, my lord, of Gondor only,' said Gandalf. 'Yet there are other men and other lives, and time still to be. And for me, I pity even his slaves.'

'And where will other men look for help, if Gondor falls?' answered Denethor. 'If I had this thing now in the deep vaults of this citadel, we should not then shake with dread under this gloom, fearing the worst, and our counsels would be undisturbed. If you do not trust me to endure the test, you do not know me yet.'

'Nonetheless I do not trust you,' said Gandalf. 'Had I done so, I could have sent this thing hither to your keeping and spared myself and others much anguish. And now hearing you speak I trust you less, no more than Boromir. Nay, stay your wrath! I do not trust myself in this, and I refused this thing, even as a freely given gift. You are strong and can still in some matters govern yourself, Denethor; yet if you had received this thing, it would have overthrown you. Were it buried beneath the roots of Mindolluin, still it would burn your mind away, as the darkness grows, and the yet worse things follow that soon shall come upon us.'


Sean said...

Really? More like bored of the rings. Honestly , Mike, I don't think that Tolkien crap has any revelance to what's going on, but if that's how you see, hokay. I ain't interested in no fairy tales, but in less long winded reality. But you and I differ on this. To beat the swine we are up against, we are going to have to be worse than them. Attila the Hun would have laughed at, and then trampled, the Queensbury Rules. We're going to need ruthless killers, not dreamers and moral men.

Anonymous said...

You've been busy,but I find it hard to believe you couldn't have personally replied to CA in the time it took you to put this post together for Sipsey Street,Mike.

Thanks for all you do and keep up the great work!


Anonymous said...

We're going to need ruthless killers, not dreamers and moral men.--Sean

So it is that one gang of cutthroats displaces another and the man of peace finds no rest for his soul.

Damn these bloodthirsty and heartless men.



The Trainer said...

Sean: I would agree that we will need men who can do hard things ruthlessly when necessary.

I would disagree that we need 'ruthless killers' because ruthless killers, by definition, have no code other than that of Ghengis Kahn: The personal whim.

A man can be truly moral and be truly ruthless in combat. I would give as an example, General Thomas Jackson, Lieutenant General, CSA. A devoutly Christian and moral man, but when joined in battle, ruthless to a fault, and in my own opinion, had he not the reverance of his Faith, would not have been such a stalwart in battle.

No, Sir. We need men of staunch moral character who possess the skill sets to fight ruthlessly, once battle is joined, but also the control to discriminate combatant from non-combatant (children, for example) and the strength to not shoot when it would be more expedient, but not morally correct, to do so.

In my own AO, there was a group at one time who talked about indiscriminant ruthlessness, or a 'scorched earth' policy. They were told if they became feral, they would be considered OPFOR.

Killing is sometimes necessary and carries no stain if done morally. Murder however, is not the same, and always carries the curse of Cain.

Now, you can minimize my .02 and tell me I'm wrong, but know this: Our merry little band trains to fight ruthlessly under a moral code simply because we differentiate ourselves from OPFOR. When all is said and done, History will not condemn those who are moral killers. Murderers? Well, think Nuremburg.

Anonymous said...

We will need men of high moral fiber and back bone to preserve the Republic.
We will also need men who can look into the enemies eyes and pull the trigger.
We can not be too weak willed, nor grow to enjoy the killing.
The IRA had a song called "A Sniper's Promise", in it a sniper spares the life of a British Soldier. We will need men willing to pull the trigger, but still live for the dream of "But when the war for freedom has been won
I promise you I'll put away my gun."
I for one am willing to pull the trigger, but will hope and pray for the day the Life of the Republic is ensured, for I will return to Kentucky with the hope of living a peaceful life.

Anonymous said...

I haven't walked in your shoes so I will not judge your actions. I am glad that CA was addressed. I have felt like my brother and I am sure may others have as well. This is a long row to hoe and the harvets, if it comes, is nothing to look forward too.

I wonder if there is any history regarding how the French, Poles or British dealt with the psychological affects of a lengthy resistence? The mind/ moral is more important than weapons and tactics.

No doubt even Atilla was inspired by myths and fairy tales. That's why they endure in every culture to give men an ideal greater than themselves to live up to. Inspiration of the warrior ethos.

What makes man dangereous is what he thinks he can do.

Thanks Mike

wl moses

Dick's Dad said...

It's only recently that I've begun to realise what Tolkein and C.S. Lewis were writing about beneath their veils of allegory.

Put Hobbes (and any Rousseau Robespierre, Hegel, Marx, Hitler Mao etc that might be lying around) back onto its shelf and go read your Locke again.

Following Hobbes gets you an absolute ruler, a strong man, a dictator. It won't get you better than you have now.

I pray that the criminal trials when this is over, aren't tainted by the same hypocrisy that Nuremberg was, and are presided over by upright judges and jurors.

Nuremberg was polluted by the presence of Stalin's judges, who had learned their corrupt trade in Stalin's show trials.

I would also suggest that Morganthau (and Keynes)should have been on trial along with the Nazis.

Rant/sermon over

rexxhead said...

We all realize, I hope, that no matter how hard we train and no matter how well we vet our comrades, there WILL arise among the moral those who are not.

When it comes to civil war, there WILL be atrocities, and WE will commit some of them. Maybe not you, and maybe not me, but someone...

rexxhead said...

P.s., Sean: LOTR is a story with a lesson. As Mike and others have pointed out, it's a lesson worth learning.

Perhaps that's just not your style :-)

Toaster 802 said...

Linked at

Out freakin' standing Mike.

We need men of staunch moral character who possess the skill sets to fight ruthlessly, once battle is joined, but also the control to discriminate combatant from non-combatant (children, for example) and the strength to not shoot when it would be more expedient, but not morally correct, to do so.

In my own AO, there was a group at one time who talked about indiscriminant ruthlessness, or a 'scorched earth' policy. They were told if they became feral, they would be considered OPFOR.

Killing is sometimes necessary and carries no stain if done morally. Murder however, is not the same, and always carries the curse of Cain.

...Sir, I will not minimize your comments, I will extol them from the roof tops.


Bad Cyborg said...

I will defend my family, my "tribe" with all that is within me. I do not enjoy violence, but neither do I necessarily avoid it. You see, I do my duty irrespective of the personal consequences. As example I offer the following:
1) It fell to me to sign the paperwork to disconnect my baby brother from life support. I first had to convince the rest of the family that it was needful. I did what I saw as my duty though my heart quailed within me. Then I held his hand as he passes - though it took 3 hours for the drugs they had given him to "stabilize him to wear off.

2) less than 48 hours later I delivered the news to my Mother that she was undoubtedly terminal and had not long to live. Completing that duty I then filled in the blanks on a DNR Mother's Dr. had signed for me to complete. In consultation with the Charge RN I detailed a course of treatment that would keep her comfortable without in any wise prolonging her death.

3) Four and one half days almost to the minute after my brother was pronounced, I pulled the nasal cannula from my now lifeless Mother's nose, having held my Father's hand as my Mother breathed her last. Then when I drove home my Baby Brother was in a baggie in a nice little wooden box in the floorboard behind my seat.

Now I have a rifle for the first time in my life. I plan to work to acquire the skill to put 5 rounds into a tea cup at 440 yards (few armor their faces and a .308 in the head is hard to shrug off). At around $.40/round it will likely be expensive. But I will do it. I will do it because I believe it to be my duty.

DAMN the Statists' eyes anyway! I could have done other things with what that rifle and accessories has cost not to mention the tuition and motel cost for the Appleseed training. I hope all of them are on someone's 100 head list.

Bad Cyborg X

Slobyskysa Rotchikokov said...

Sean said -
" we are going to have to be worse than them." -
if we are even worse than what we have now, why would we even want to exist? If the best we could hope for is to live in a society of sociopathic cutthroats and barbarians, why not just move to Iran or any other muslim sh*thole?

Dennis308 said...

This was what I commented @ WRSA

C.A. It's that the "Old Culture" is not dead that is the problem.

A couple of these Moral rules that you quote,

Don't hurt people (at least those who don't need hurting).
Anyone that would take from you deserves hurting

Pay your taxes.(so that the TPTB can give the fruits of your labor to someone else)

Obey the law.(Whose Law? The Law that has been corrupted by the same TPTB)

Respect authority.(Not one that will NOT Respect My Rights)

Be a good citizen.(Not at the Cost of my own Liberty, so that TPTB continue Cheat and Rob, Rape, And Murder on my behalf

Read the major news periodicals so that you are familiar with the issues of the day.(So I can hear more Lies from the Collaborators of again TPTB

Register and vote in every election.(When someone is worthy of my Vote I Vote for them and not the lesser of Two EVILS

Be kind to others.(Kindness will be Very Rare Commodity in the near future so if you can find some treasure it, and don't be to generous for Kindness is too often mistaken for weakness

These are the reasons that we are failing as a Nation. And Failing as a Resistance. The time is here Now to take off the gloves. This is a WAR that we are in. Just because someone has Not Fired That First Shot doesn't make it Any Less of a War. The Shooting (and worse) will Commence soon enough.

Just Don't despair trust in your Higher Power,(for me a God that I never understood before)that you have come to understand in these last 30 years of your life. I too know that same battle 16 yrs. and still counting.

You see what is happening in Wisconsin and soon to be in Cities and States all across country. The Gig is up, Free-Fall is about to hit Bottom and now the Fear and Anger of the Entitled will come to surface. This is why so many have been preparing in every way that they can. Soon all that we have known was coming will be at hand and it will be for the Survivors of this First Kill Off to fight for a New Republic to be Rebuilt, Looking back at the mistakes of our last Generations.

I can very easily understand where C.A. is coming from, Response from people in "The Resistance/Restoration" has been less than encouraging. When the RTC Rally happened down here in Texas there where 5 count them five men who bothered to show. It was a Saturday, People SAID they would come a couple hundred by my calculations. The Tea Party People wouldn't be present if their were guns. NRA crowd didn't want "OTHER
PEOPLE" to get the Wrong IDEA.

I am still waiting for that spark (SSeiu)to light-off the powder keg. Not because I want a Civil War here in my home land. But the way I see it is there can be no U.S.A. if there is a Restoration.

We are not "One Nation Under God"
We are no longer One Nation in any sense of the word. We have been divided by Ideologies and Politics.
And until "We" can get over being
"POLITE" about keeping our right to live the way we chose to live.
We will NOT be able to claim our own lives much less Restore a Republic.

I am not saying we need to be cold blooded killers(sorry Sean) but we DO NEED TO BE READY TO KILL IN COLD BLOOD.


cross posted and linked at

Pericles said...

One of the guys I admire in life has said that very often, people lose hope and give up when they are on the cusp of great success.

Anonymous said...

Thanks Mike....I was treated as a pariah in the comment section for WesternRifleShooters b/c I dared to disagree with Pete on this issue.

This isn't the first time either....when he advocated FreeFor may have to attack civilians in one of his other columns, I disagreed then and asked for more clarification of his point.

This time I was a bit less subtle. ;)

Oh well, I still think he was wrong and you are right....we cannot become the evil we seek to replace. Even if we manage to gain victory, without honor, it will ring hollow.


"Bad" Sean

Anonymous said...

One of the more thoughtful responses to CA'S post in WRSA opined about the time lapse between the Boston Massacre and the actual kickoff at Lexington Green. It was six years.
Yes, it is frustrating. But as Vito Corleone said, revenge is a dish best supped when it is cold. Be of good cheer. Plan, prepare, network, exercise, and pray. With events accelerating in the Mideast, the spike in oil prices will destroy Helicopter Ben's QE2. They cannot keep the lid on the garbage can much longer. The way our returning veterans are being treated will have great bearing on the response of National Guard units to actions and demonstrations by the patriot remnant. Hold your nose and watch some of Glenn Beck's rants. Listen to Michael Savage. Identify the Qusilings and Fellow Travelers in your A/O. It all may happen sooner than this fat old veteran thinks!

Pat H. said...

Of course there's not going to be a "restoration" (of the Constitution). That's due to two things, First, the Constitution itself was born of a conspiracy to usurp the Articles of Confederation by the Federalists, a cabal of vested interests.

Second, the Constitution is working precisely as intended. The Federalists wanted the centralizing, leviathan state. Hamilton, mainly, but his fellow travelers, wanted this obscenity.

So, there's nothing to restore. There's never been anything to restore, those who think there is, are engaging in self deception of the worst kind.

Scott J said...


Roughly .25 cents a round if you reload 'em yourself.

And that includes buying once fired brass.

Concerned American said...


Where in the "Read One Article" post do I say what you attribute to me, per below?

“… but if we can believe the wisdom of some of our own truly best thinkers, some of the finest minds of the 3% movement and the libertarians, RTC, 2A and such, then none of it matters, it is all over, there won't be any shooting at all and we are all lost, so we might as well hand over our guns and ammo, and pray to the dot govs for their forgiveness and leniency.

That is all that I can make of the posts of recent days; that the gov will keep quietly taking rights away, never a confrontation, and no escape for anyone. It seems that now, among the right wing thinkers, all is lost and resistance is, indeed, futile.”

Punch line is that I did not say that. Please clarify in your post.

As to the measure of our ongoing defeats, try these objective facts 2006-2011:

1) Growth in joint Federal-state fusion centers;

2) Growth in military-equipment-supplied-and-trained local and state police personnel;

3) Growth in Federal indebtedness;

4) Growth in Federal unfunded liabilities; and

5) Growth in DHS budget and personnel.

As for those folks who assert the need to maintain the moral high ground in the ongoing conflict with the collectivists, I would ask them

- When was the last time the United States unequivocally won a major war?

- What strategies and tactics were utilized to achieve that victory?

(see next)

Concerned American said...


My overall points in "Read One Article" stand:

...And spare me, please, just this once, the bellowing, chesty "From my seventy-pounds-overweight cold, dead hands in a pile of hot brass with my .308 man's rifle by any means necessary but only after sufficient provocation lest we slide into the abyss when we gaze into becoming the beast we are fighting for our eternal souls" self-serving-and-deluding masturbatory-fantasy horseshit.

Just this once.

Please. For the love of all that is holy.

Readers of this blog know how few people will actually show up, let alone fight - in any circumstance.

Snyder called it right.

Let me be blunt, dear friends -- anybody noticed any bankers going missing lately?


How about union leaders?

Government lawyers?

The other major and minor cannibals strutting about your AO - every single one of them still has all ten fingers and ten toes, right?

You do understand that these gang members have destroyed the country into which you were born, and ensured that your children and grandchildren face a nearly-inescapable future as debt serfs, right?

Go back now, please, and re-read those last six questions.

Think for a few seconds on each.

Do you understand yet?

At least this old rule still applies:

When you're sitting around the card table, trying to decide who the sucker is, and you can't tell......

It's you.

The old way's over, boys and girls.

New World Order, indeed.

Form your own gang, or get eaten by someone else's gang.

It's just that simple, and just that inescapable...

Readers of this comment, please go now and re-read Snyder's article cited above.

Ask yourself whether or not he called it right, based on observed facts, rather than wishes, hopes, or prayers.

Like it or not, Mike, the hordes of serial offenders against the American way are walking about planning their next series of depredations while the so-called "freedom movement" does virtually nothing that is meaningful.

[And yes, I am well aware of Gunwalker, and as always, I offer my kudos to you, David, and the rest of the merry band. But as you well remember, these Fed agencies are the same people who successfully murdered women and children in both Idaho and Texas in the Nineties. Their punishment? Uh.....well, there's.....uh....etc. It is my sincere wish that Gunwalker ends with greater results that the aftermaths of Ruby Ridge and Waco. Time alone will tell.]

I'll close with the quote from Rand:

"We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality."

Mike, the prescription you set forth to the freedom community, albeit under a different set of descriptors, is a prescription of continued consent to tyranny and abuse, so long as Leviathan does not offend too greatly. Only at some point discernable to the Truly Wise Ones will resistance be justified, according to that strategy.

To that, old friend, I say "Good luck with that".

What if Leviathan is smart enough to keep its appetites below that action threshold claimed by the Truly Wise Ones?

What then?

Concerned American said...

One final observation:

The point about Leviathan being smart enough and adaptable enough to keep its encroachments below a likely-to-provoke-direct-response level is not a hypothetical.

It is, in fact, what has been happening for years, if not decades.

Are you more free today than you were ten years ago?

What about twenty years ago?


Anonymous said...

"What if Leviathan is smart enough to keep its appetites below that action threshold claimed by the Truly Wise Ones?"

If the enemy were capable of restraining their appetites, they wouldn't be the enemy. Their lack of restraint will soon start things off. Don't waste all of your strength chafing at the bit, so that you're already out of the race before it starts.

There will be enough for everyone.


Dick's Dad said...

C. A.

I agree that we are less free than we were 10, 15, or 20 years ago.

As a Brit, I'm not so sure about extending back over 30 years. Britain between 1914 and 1979 seemed like it was on a conveyor belt to serfdom. There was a slowing or even a slight reversal in the eighties and nineties.

Yes there is a militarisation of policing, but look at current events in the former police state of Libya.

Some of The Colonel's Mig pilots have flown their planes to Malta rather than fire on fellow citizens, there are soldiers joining the protests, their weaponry now faces the Colonel's ever lessening forces.

The Libyans are not people with a grounding in Classical Liberalism, They're grounded in two of the most brutal and murderous tribal collectivisms ever; national socialism and islam, but look how they are acting.

When a tipping point comes, it comes.

After a restoration will come fair trials for criminals (of both sides).

Everyone should be aware that trials will come, and that all criminal acts willbe punished.

Dave said...

In fact, we're doing just the opposite of taking action against our oppressors - we are financing them! We are the stupidest people in history!!!

America passed the point of no-return years ago. There is no way to fix this mess without starting over. And as long as those who wish to regain freedom are randomly scattered around the country amidst the sheep the government will continue its course without any meaningful opposition.

One simple solution ("simple" does not equal "painless") would be to accept the fact that America is hopelessly divided and a large part of it has to be "written off" as a loss. Patriots will have to relocate to a specific geographical location. (For example Wyoming, Arizona, Idaho...) Imagine a state filled predominately with patriots. Rule of law, Constitutional government, and state sovereignty could be re-established. Capitalism could be re-born in America. If the feds don't go along with this little scheme, the next step would be secession. But that won't happen until everyone can agree on a location and a strategy. And that's unlikely.

And by the way, American and world history is full of inspiring examples of the type of men who successfully fought against tyranny - why is there a question now?

Dutchman6 said...


The quote was provided by Rick from past discussions and I probably screwed it up. It i now fixed. Everything I do these days is in a rush. It breaks my heart that you're drifting to the dark side. It looks like I can't find a ride to Atlanta so we won't be able to discuss this face to face. That is unfortunate. Rick sent me the piece privately. I posted it because I'm getting a lot of emails worrying about your "descent into darkness" as one guy put it. Your ideas are fair game, no? It wasn't a personal attack. You're scaring the shit out of some people, me included.


Anonymous said...

1Lt, Taylor Homes, ret.

Thank You.

Sean said...

Note that I didn't say we had to STAY ruthless. A thing often comes to mind, from The Blue Max. A squadron leader asks a general "What about honor?". And the general replies, "Stored lovingly, for better times".

Anonymous said...

Timing is everything. Pete's timing is off, way off. In my opinion action as he advocates now simply constitutes a trap. We are on the cusp of partial restoration by virtue of political action(s) in several states. Attitudes are budging in liberty's direction. DC is showing titilating signs of budget control, but it appears to be a literal drop in the bucket as to what is required for a real repair. It's simply indeterminant at this point if DC is salvageable. Hopeful and cautiously optimistic, yes. Fooled, no. Historically, with any apparent improvement, DC falls quickly back into the abyss, simply inventing new ways to take our money and control us. This is obvious to even the most casual observer.

Mike, you're right, we must maintain our Christian duallity. If we should, in all our supposed splendor cut lose with unprovoked violence (arguable philosophically and to a degree historically as in Waco, Ruby Ridge), we will surely lose the favor or defacto support by neutrality of all or nearly all of the remainder of sleepy Americans as well as many in our own movement as they will see the mistaken timing. We'll then see them support (standing neutral is defacto support for the prevailing wind) an effort to route the newly characterized 'offenders' or 'homegrown terrorists' out. If that should happen, then the movement will surely be reduced to returning to closets if not effectively eliminated and the fate of the Republic will be sealed. We must be very calculated in our efforts. For example, use the rule of law to our advantage and press the advantage. I.e. Gunwalker and Obamacare lawsuits. Likewise, work tirelessly at the local/state level towards restoration. At this point, I believe the only way to tame the DC leviation without a bloody revolt is through electing the proper folks particularly at the State level, enabling the many States to back their 10A sovereignty, by force if necessary, thus relegating DC useless. There is a sea change afoot, let's not blow it now with tribal thinking.

When/if Ms. Wolf's 'awkward moment' passes, we'll all know. There will be no need for pronouncement. It will be obvious to all citizens what will be required. Be it peace or force.

Lest anyone think restoration would happen quickly or by snappy actions, they are the fools of frustration and will be taken out of the effort before their time. Rather, we should be calculatingly intelligent about how we spend our time and fortune, and recognize the Restoration will take much sweat, perseverence, improvisation and adaptation to overcome.


Bob Katt

Anonymous said...

This reminds me of another episode in The Lord of the Rings. Aragorn, fleeing Moria after Gandalf had fallen:

He looked toward the mountains and held up his sword. “Farewell, Gandalf!” he cried. “Did I not say to you : if you pass the doors of Moria, beware? Alas that I speak true. What hope have we without you?”

He turned to the Company. “We must do without hope,” he said. At least we may yet be avenged. Let us gird ourselves and weep no more! Come! We have a long road, and much to do.”

Anonymous said...

We all saw what happened with the Hutaree. For many of the same reasons cited by CA they developed a plan and were busted for it. Now how much of what we have heard is true or false, I do not know. Personally, I think they were baited, but that is beside the point. The real issue is how the III community responded when it all went down. In short, the Hutaree were shunned. Everyone else immediately put distance between themselves and the Hutaree.

While I do not disagree with CA that we have taken a great fall, we do need a specific turning point to justify action. It's too late to rise up in reaction to things that happened more than three days ago.

The situation in WI is happening right now, but I don't see Pete, Kerodin, and others hunting Dem Senators in IL with intentions to force them back to Madison, WI. We can't be picky in our choice or location of opportunities when they arise.

If they are itching for escalation then they will immediately react with leadership the moment the next opportunity arises. If CA, Kerodin, and others feel they have justification to escalate things then no one has power to stop them. By escalating things I do not mean rallying up the troops, inspiring followers, or inciting others. Being a keyboard commando is not leadership. Leadership means being the first to go where no one wants to go, do things no one wants to do, and risk things no one wants to risk. They have that freedom and others will follow if they have a righteous cause. However, without high moral ground they will also be shunned like the Hutaree. It really is that simple.

So what event could serve as the next opportunity? Unless SCOTUS overrules the health care mandate, for sure January 1, 2014 is on the calendar. A host of other things could happened between now and then. If they want to keep complaining about people who won't rise up, they should take a good look in the mirror. It's for this reason I do not consider them to have much of value to contribute to the cause.

Anonymous said...

Pete is not decending into darkness, he is looking right into the maw of the shadow about to fall over us all.
LOTR is very appro. We are standing on the walls of The White City beholding the approaching armies of Mordor as they prepare their seige. Many are looking for a far off action to lay low the vile scum at our door. But we have no Frodo set to destroy the Ring of Power. We have no Aragorn that will bring the Rohan cavalry and an army of the dead.
We are IT! There is no far off action that will relieve the siege.
I think what Pete is saying is that we have to face the fact that we are few and that we must use a toolbox of tactics to achieve efficency of force. I dont see Pete advocating targeting innocents what I see is a recognition that this battle cannot be fought against the hordes of Mordor on THEIR terms. If we are to achieve victory we must husband our resources and fight only on OUR terms. Waiting for them to slowly boil you while you say " I am about to get to the point where I will think about responding" is not fighting on our terms.


Anonymous said...

Leadership means being the first to go where no one wants to go, do things no one wants to do, and risk things no one wants to risk.

It's for this reason I do not consider [Kerodin Pete, et. al.] to have much of value to contribute to the cause.
--Anon@8:05 (2/22)

If the leadership cannot endure adversity without retreating into a self-pitying, protective shell, we need to find ourselves new leaders. The measure of a man is what he suffers *before* the battle is joined.

The hardships of forced marches are often more painful than the dangers of battle. --General Thomas J. "Stonewall" Jackson


Xenophon said...

I still have my copy of DA pamphlet No.550-104 titled " Human Factors Considerations of Undergrounds in Insurgencies." It's actually a book. I suspect that a few of you know where it was required reading. Hint: Phase III. Here is part of it in a nutshell-- folks in a resistance will tire and will have doubts. They will feel isolated. And by nature, the structure of a resistance in quiet times is a hotbed for those feelings to develop. This works to the advantage of the oppressors. On the flip side, smart insurgents will use the quiet times to further recruit, prepare, and plan for the open hostilities under better conditions than if conflict was already in the open. A resistance has in order of quantity of supporters-- an underground, an auxiliary, and the fighters. In short, there are lots of folks out there willing to give more support to the fighters than they are showing now but it's just not time for them to step in the breach. We all see different things being our Concord Bridge. Once we agree on what the final intolerable action is, then it will be on. And what when it happens, it may be some other group's vision that triggers it and then there will be no more time to prepare. So use this time wisely.

Anonymous said...

"Are you more free today than you were ten years ago?"

Ten years ago was 2001.

The AW Ban was intact, and just about any gunowner you asked said that it would never expire.

On Sept 14th 2004, the ban died and gun control efforts to revive it have failed continuously.

Even the attempted assassination of a member of Congress by a nutcase didn't help them.

There have been hiccups; Katrina comes to mind, as does the case of the hapless guy in New Jersey. But...those are just hiccups.

And now we're seeing states revolting against greedy employee unions!

These are all little baby steps, but the average VOTER is no longer afraid of their government, in fact, they're getting angry.

Concerned American said...

Gentlemen and ladies:

For the commenters who express their sincere concern, I thank you for it. I am fine - really.

For the commenters who rail because I point out uncomfortable facts, I am sorry for your pain. I hope as your vision clears and your pain diminishes, you will have clarity.

For the retired 1LT who told me to shut the fuck up, do your fucking job pursuant to your oath. Literally thousands of oathbreakers in all three branches of government at the Federal, state, and local levels scoff at the Constitution and routinely savage it, but you are all pissy because my writing caused some people to feel uncomfortable?

Whiskey tango foxtrot?

Grow a pair and fulfill your oath....unless you took one of the special expiring-at-a-date-certain ones.

Good luck to each and every one.

Anonymous said...

"Consent of the governed" is an oxymoron. You can have liberty, or you can have politics; there is no middle ground. Until this is understood and liberty is chosen, Sipsey Street is carrying the football towards the wrong goal. Politics cannot be reformed any more than slavery can.

CA writes: "The point about Leviathan being smart enough and adaptable enough to keep its encroachments below a likely-to-provoke-direct-response level is not a hypothetical.

It is, in fact, what has been happening for years, if not decades.

The Bad People have failed to train their next generation of rulers. If the Bad People were in control they would be teaching the Skull and Bones types how to be Kings; instead they're teaching them to be Keynes. The Bad People are crumbling, all you need to do is stand back out of the way.

I don't think Orwell's prescription in _1984_ about how to create a permanent self-policing tyranny will work, because it has never worked in the past. 1984's plan required tech growth to stop. That has never occurred in the past.

1Lt. Taylor Holmes, ret. said...

"For the retired 1LT who told me to shut the fuck up, do your fucking job pursuant to your oath. Literally thousands of oathbreakers in all three branches of government at the Federal, state, and local levels scoff at the Constitution and routinely savage it, but you are all pissy because my writing caused some people to feel uncomfortable?"

Uncomfortable? It's you who is wailing at the railing. Your defeatist scree labels you as impatient, undisciplined, unschooled and unfit.

I'll say it AGAIN. IT AIN'T TIME YET. Got it? It is NOT time. You want a particular outcome, right? Well, to achieve that, you need all kinds of things, not the least of which is the possibility of success within the current circumstances. Fighting a battle just to say you did is idiocy. Standing back and keeping watch for THE MOMENT is both mature and reasonable.

You do NOBODY any good DEAD. When will we see your manly pair rotting in the street? Are you going to play dumbshit and pull the trigger? I pity your family, and I'm sorry for their loss. There are times to lose your life willingly in battle, such as when trying to pull a recently intact buddy from a hole, or charging a bunker to save pinned down pals. Maybe a field expedient blood transfusion.... things like that. What you suggest has no achievable goal.

So.... if YOU can't win the current scenario, what.... cry about it? Piss and moan? Shut up, man, and work to change the rules or conditions. Who ever said you had to limit yourself to what has been given you? You're not stupid. Use you brain. It's better than getting it blown out. Do something to alter the conditions to your favor, and that of whatever cause you ascribe.

But while you are figuring out just how to do that, please....

....just shut the fuck up.