Wednesday, December 31, 2014

Comment on the SAF lawsuit by a WA state firearm rights activist.

Second Amendment Foundation is Pro-Infringement, But Files Token Lawsuit Against I-594
Here’s a news flash: Alan Gottlieb, along with his Second Amendment Foundation, is all for giving up your Second Amendment rights.
BTW, this is Kit singing the National Anthem at the 13 December I Will Not Comply rally in Olympia. Gave me shivers when I heard it in person.


Left Coast Conservative said...

I do not agree with your assesment of Alan Gottlieb, or the SAF. The SAF news release is describing their legal theory of their case. Had I-594 been worded differently, then the legal theory would be different.

You're condemning Gottlieb because he is bowing to the political necessity of acknowledging that background checks are not going to disappear completely, and discounting all that he, and the SAF, have done to repeal the worst anti-gun excesses.

Anonymous said...

Is there ANY national group worth my dues dollars? I've seen enough to know NRA is not interested in protecting my 2A rights. It's abundantly clear that Gottlieb's SAF is not interested in doing anything but fund raising. So who else is there on a national basis? Or IS there anybody currently on the national scene that would not be a waste of my dues?

Bjorn said...

I've discussed litigation strategy with SAF last May...their approach is to incrementally dismantle the anti-2A laws on the books (they were incrementally passed).

I really do not agree that SAF is "giving up our 2A rights".

I take issue with GOAs "all or nothing" approach. There have been missed opportunities to incrementally roll back bad legislation because GOA did not believe it went far enough.

That said, I'm Life Member of NRA, GOA and SAF. None are perfect; each have their strengths and weaknesses. I'm glad they are all here...they all need to accomplish more.

Anonymous said...

Bjorn - the NRA has said exactly the same thing, for decades, just legislatively. The only success has been continuing to collect "donations".

SAF isn't asking the very BASIC questions CLAIMING to fear what will happen if they aren't answered honestly. CLAIMING that courts will just toss the suits.


I say let's FORCE the judiciary to face up to the fundamental questions. DARE them to DUCK them over and over again. See, there comes a point where their denials become so nonsensical, so petty, so pathetic, and so DANGEROUS that the judiciary cannot risk it to duck anymore.

Example - come Dick Heller and company, the judiciary (and the gun rights organizations) just couldn't WOULDNT DARE risk telling the American people that the right to keep and bear wasn't individual. They risked the whole cabal collapsing if they did so. They KNEW IT and had no choice but to ADMIT IT.

IN every district there exists either an open or concealed carry ban. It seems to me that NATIONAL orgss could EASILY recruit one person in each area who will openly defy the ban, take the arrest and kick off title 42 section 1983 defense strategies. Dispsrate decisions will follow - all over the map. Repeat this over and over - weekly- until the judiciary is literally embarrassing itself. When done OPENLY from the get go - SCOTUS will want to protect its own britches!
Question asked -
If a bible carriage is a matter of right, and it's a individual liberty to decide open or concealed carriage, and the second amendment is no different than the first, how could open carry and concealed carry of arms be any different than carrying a bible?

Quite frankly, we either need to OPENLY CHALLENGE "time place and manner" now OR it will just be endlessly used to whittle "rights" really are just permissions granted by gubmint.

Republican Party / democrat party - both just want to keep issues for the next election cycle. Gotta have those fundraising talking points!!! Time to face it - NRA and SAF have jumped FULLY on THAT bandwagon.

Since heller and McDonald - not ONE thing has TRULY changed. Government is STILL claiming ownership of our Creator endowed rights, doling out permission to only those who pay ransom - bribe- extortion- jailing those who refuse. They are just releasing more permission slips - just enough to tone down the restless peasants.

And FUDDS are falling for it. Pathetic.

Carl Stevenson said...

GOA is, as far as I can tell, the best, now that JPFO was (much to my objection and disgust) taken over by SAF.
NAGR does nothing I can see except incessantly beg for money by email. I've been trying to get toes fuckers to unsubscribe me from their email list for 2 months now.

Carl Stevenson said...

Left coast ... There is NO such "political necessity"
We're sick of whimps who preemptive,y surrender our rights in our name without our consent.

AJ said...

I have previously expressed my feelings about Alan Gottlieb on a couple of previous occasions. You can bet that I will be showing up at the next WAC BoD meeting to tell him in person and raise some serious hell. We don't need another NRA that rides the crisis at hand and raises money to give their employees a comfy living. We need organizations that are actually trying to defend our rights. And if some day, the fight is over, and we have actually won, and they have to go get real jobs, then so be it.
I'll take GOA's all or nothing approach. If GOA had NRA's membership number, you can damn well bet we would no longer be on the defensive all of the time.

Anonymous said...

it's very simple; who are you going to follow; JudenRATe Gottlieb to the cattle cars or Kit "who will never comply" to your freedom!

Death before slavery!

Comrade X

Unknown said...

Gottieb's SAF strategy of trading some essential liberties for others and temporary safety does NOT incrementally regain us our independent rights and liberties back. That strategy merely perpetuates the flow of constant monies into his hands. Not that making monies in of itself is bad, but in this manner it does not do as those who pump that money into that leviathan believe it to do.

Those in WA state may or may not remember HB 1588, but Gottlieb's SAF strategy was to acquiesce to Universal Background Checks (UBCs)and in exchange, eliminate the State's pistol registry. Gottlieb's SAF "claimed" this strategy killed HB 1588 because the State's Progressive dominantly filled Legislature would not lose that registry. Thing is, is that UBCs would require, in order to be an "effective" law, a fully maintained registration of all firearm ownership. The fact of the matter IS, is that HB 1588 was not defeated by Gottlieb's SAF stategy, but by the righteous fight from the grassroots Individuals themselves who demanded of their legislators to let that Bill DIE. Yet these same individuals are marginalized as being the very ones who might scare those legislators into supporting anti-gun laws some more. I say yes, they should be scared, but scared of the consequences of their incorrect actions.

Yeah, some like to "think" that Gottlieb's SAF is a grassroots organization, but it is not. Gottlieb's SAF tells its members what SAF is going to do, and that its members MUST support the decisions of the SAF board both socially and monetarily. Hubris I say. Individuals MUST be individually involved in their own self governing. KNOW what Liberty's teeth are, use it, and keep your powder dry.