Monday, April 14, 2014

Well, that was interesting. I was just thrown out of an Ohio Carry (Central Chapter) meeting. My speech in Columbus on the 19th now apparently up in the air.

It's been a long day, folks. It was made longer by the following saga. You may recall that I was invited to speak at the Patriot's Day celebration at the Ohio Statehouse on the 19th. Since I am now up in Ohio and had yet to hear of any details or recent confirmation, I went to the library this afternoon to see if I could get ahold of the event organizers. You will note that the announcement indicates that Central Ohio Carry and Ohioans for Concealed Carry are both listed as being represented at the event. Since I could not find the email address of the fellow I originally talked to, and noting from the Ohio Carry website that the Central Ohio chapter was having a meeting tonight on the southeast side of Columbus, I determined that the easiest way to make contact was to show up at the meeting, find the fellow who had invited me and confirm some arrangements. It was an hour's drive away from where I am staying (which doesn't have Internet access, so I'm using the local library and Panera Bread's wifi) I figured, what the heck.
So down I drove, located the meeting site at a local buffet, and then came back at the appointed time. As the group filtered in there was no sign of the fellow who invited me, but the members indicated that he should be coming so I stuck around. None of them was familiar wuth my name, but that's okay, I get that all the time these days and accept it as a sign of the success of the idea (you may recall my reaction at the same thing happening in CT at last year's rally). There was some side conversation about whether or not this was to be a business meeting and it was decided by the half-dozen or so folks there that, no, "thank God," they would just have some conversation over the meal, so it was all very informal. I introduced myself and handed out some cards and listened as they talked about their plans for open carry events. I was especially interested in one that they were planning after the rally on Saturday, when they intended to march onto the campus of Ohio State and I indicated that I would be happy to come along. Like many such groups I've met across the country, they seemed sincere, intelligent and determined. It was when I went to get a refill on my hot tea (I declined to go the thirteen dollar tab for a meal, although the tea was three bucks) when everything went south.
Coming back to the table, an otherwise intelligent and sincere young man in a wheelchair was explaining to the group that "the Davidians had it coming" because "they were converting hand grenades and automatic weapons." Given that he seemed not to be old enough to even have been born in 1993 and sick of twenty years of that kind of crap from firearm-confiscating collectivists, I instantly saw red and blurted out (with what I admit was an absolute lack of tact), "That's bullshit!" He then went on to claim that the Davidians had also fired first. I said, "No they didn't. The ATF fired first. They shot the dogs as they always do." I also told the young man not to be blaming the victims. Now, I perfectly understand the reaction, but the crowd turned on me with a vengeance and indicated that I could take my objections walking and they threw me out of the meeting, such as it was. One of them (also probably in diapers when the FBI was immolating those innocents that he figured had it coming) said that I was a "crazy old douchebag," or words to that effect. I indicated that when they got ahold of the guy who had invited me to come up from Alabama to speak that he should get in touch with me and let me know if it had been a waste of time. Then I left.
So, having learned nothing that I needed to know and as ignorant as before I drove back to where I am staying. My speech, it would seem, is entirely up in the air. In truth, they had not invited me to their meeting and it was well within their rights to ask me to leave, so I really bear them no rancor. But some of them sure don't know shit from shinola about Waco.

77 comments:

Anonymous said...


Mike I'm sorry to hear about your conflict in the buckeye.

It's a shame so many folks buy into the msm story on so many issues, and trying to show them the truth is like arguing with a insane person.

Anonymous said...

Sounds like you 'met' the FBI informant in that group riding a wheelchair. I imagine once he is away from the group, he can get up and walk around just fine. Consider yourself fortunate. If I were you, I'd just shy away from that group and observe from afar. I expect there will be a 'bust-out' of it in future months.

Paul Kisling said...

Well well central Ohio carry is a bunch of Cunt Posers. The main Ohio Carry site has the threeper sign on it. Kind of fitting that 3 percent are not half wits.

FedUp said...

I don't call BS on strangers, I'd just calmly tell them "no, the Davidians didn't do that".

If they were true blue Prozis (were you in some godforsaken place like Columbus??), the effect would have been the same as looking them in the eye and saying they were full of bullshit.

Anonymous said...

A Prophet has no honor in his own Country!

Though as young'uns mature and gain experience they remember that 'the Old Guy' was right ...

Keep spreading the message.

III

Anonymous said...

Well the COCC suckers just hung themselves with their own rope. They will not be getting any kind of assist from me or mine. Ever. Bunch of Fudds who can't see the truth beyond their own selfish interests.

Meister said...

You have to remember that it was only a few years ago that Ohio became a carry state. These people were mostly union born and bred, as well as having a very liberal leadership in the government. It takes time to deprogram a populace to the point that they will listen to anything other than the nightly broadcast leviathan. I remember Waco, I remember the constant media bombardment of the "guilty til death" mantra that the feds were carrying. Young people learn from manipulated history, not the truth.

A little tact will go a long way in converting many. Your conversion wasn't hostile, neither was mine. Most effective conversions from the blue brigade aren't hostile. Keep your head up and your eye on the prize. See you in a few weeks in Indy.

Anonymous said...

As a 33-year-old Ohioan, this really disappoints me. Oh well, hopefully those were just a few knuckleheads and not the norm. Don't let them discourage you, keep up the good fight!!

Average Moke said...

I sure don't blame you for getting testy at all. The older I get the less that the youngun's know. Maybe things will turn out well - who knows? Maybe the guy that invited you up has a better grasp of recent history and things work out.

michael said...

Lack of history Mike, I run into it all the time. Things passed by word of mouth….

bondmen said...

This embarrassing account You told us could have been kept a sad sorry secret but you are a real man and the truth is your currency while a moment of reflection reveals the sorry ones are those who bought the government propagandists BS hook line and sinker. Such government school boys never did like reading books I guess and would apparently rather be hand fed the feral pablum.

If your contact asks you to stay it might be a good time to to recount a few critical aspects of the WACO conflagration and its relevance for US today. We are a very needy people Mike, do we have what it takes to remain free?

Anonymous said...

Sad to see the lie machine is still pumping out propaganda about Waco.

If they really wanted to get Koresh on something, it should have been child marriages....and that could have been done on one of his many trips into town by dept of health and human services.

No real proof of weapons violations was ever found, though I believe the feds said that out of the rubble and ashes they found full auto parts and other ATF regulated (in direct contradiction to the 2A) items.

Howie Honky said...

Just blow off the 19th; you don't need to grace such ayholes with your presence anyway. My dear old Uncle Walter ( really great-uncle) had a saying, "F*ck 'em and feed 'em fish heads".
The snot nose punk who ran his mouth about Waco probably got the story from his grandpaw Horihuchi.

Backwoods Engineer said...

Freaking unbelievable.

I was in my early 20's when Waco went down, and I knew then that the government was on the wrong side.

If Mr. "The Davidians had it coming" represents the majority opinion in this country, then yes, America is doomed to a heart-wrenching split and a 2nd Civil War. I say that with profound sadness.

But Mike, not all the young folk in this country are as ignorant as that d-bag. My kids are in their teens and 20's, and they can both cite what really happened at both Ruby Ridge and at Waco. They know freedom, and they know tyranny. Maybe they are in the minority, but sometimes, a determined minority is enough.

CB said...

Moses tried to alleviate the suffering his people by killing an Egyptian. They turned on him.

Until those in bondage catch the vision themselves, frustration will be your reward. Just keep doing your song and dance. Some know the lyrics but they don't know the melody. Until the melody gets into their hearts, the lyrics do little good.

eddy 3 said...

Columbus hasn't changed much from my days there, and that is a long story. Keep the faith Mike, as I know you will. We have had some good days here lately, but I feel they are going to get tough soon.

Anonymous said...

" But some of them sure don't know shit from shinola about Waco."

Yeah... but it doesn't always keep them from talking like they do.

I will say that you were less combative than I likely would've been. Some folks just gotta look at the differences that separate us all, instead of those commonalities that bring us together.

Anonymous said...

Fucking Millennials. No social skills and never learned to debate. The best they come up with is "douche bag" and they think they've won.

Oh Lord, hasten the day that knocks that self-righteous smile off their face.

Unknown said...

The truth is, as you raised your voice, you were also rapidly walking toward the young man (he is 29) and nobody was sure what you were going to do.

We are a peaceful group. This was our monthly meeting to discuss our future walks and charity events. That is what we do.

Everyone is welcome to attend our meetings. You were treated with respect until that specific incident took place.

The gentleman that you say invited to to speak at the event next weekend did attend later and did not recognize you by name.

Carolyn

Anonymous said...

Paid agent provacatuer.

Bad as that is, in our neck of the woods, the host of "The Second Amendment Radio Show" doesn't say Second Amendment RIGHTS (or as they should be called, rights that predate the Second Amendment), he called them PRIVILEGES. Guy is a racist piece of trash too.

http://www.2ndamendmentshow.com/

Liberty is an all or nothing proposition, I'm with Bob Wright, I have no time for people who feel they need to wear camo when the situation specifically does not require it, and actually requires not wearing it. I have no time for people who won't fight for the truth, be they Branch Davidians, people of color, whatever.

You get it. Sadly, that is why this isn't the 53%

Allen said...

sad that people either don't remember the truth, or don't WANT the truth.

we've fought so many battles that are forgotten now, by the new generation. and by some of us.

I mention things all the time to people and they look at me as though I'm speaking a foreign language. as if this stuff never happened. I was there. I KNOW it happened.

like the patriot rally we had in cornish,NH the weekend after the OKC bombing and every news crew showing up from everywhere..

seems like I've been in this fight forever. not as long as some..but a lot has happened in almost 20 years. that's a long time getting ready for the fight you hope never comes.

Anonymous said...

Wow, that's sad. They should watch some of the movies on YouTube.

Anonymous said...

Mike, I wonder if the young person who spoke up about the Davidians was undercover or a paid snitch. Then again, if he were, it would be unwise to draw attention to himself in this way. If it was simply ignorance, it is a sad thing that the Clinton Admin/Big Media narrative prevailed, even among people who should know better.

When I was involved with highpower matches in the '90s, we once had someone we didn't know come out and videotape the match. One of our members got a phone call from an unknown person who mentioned other unknown (to us) people and said they told him that our member could build rifles to order, under the table, so to speak. Our member said, "No, I don't do that, because it's illegal." Even though we were DCM-affiliated with meticulous attention to the laws/rules, and ran NRA-sanctioned matches, we always assumed that "Big Brother is watching."
RJ

Anonymous said...

so many mis informed, so little time

Anonymous said...

Ohio is a piece of shit anyway - thanks to them we have obozo as president twice - though plenty of aholes in my Virginia voted for him too. Sorry you wasted a trip - carry on.
Probably a few good folks up there - but not in that group

Anonymous said...

I can tell you how may Americans, especially gun owners who have bought the lie that, "the Davidians had it coming", or "deserved what they got", or "they were raping babies, making bombs, cooking meth, etc."

Shame on them.

smitty said...

Please don't judge all Ohioans based on that experience;-)

On the other hand, how do some of those purportedly on 'our' side come to unquestionably hold such idiotic opinions?

Sounds like some *selective credibility* going on...

Mike in KY said...

Well, if you still speak at their event, I'd reckon a some slight revisions of that speech might be in order.

At this point, hell, I'd just shake their dust from my feet and move on. Damn northerners. They all seem to suffer from a collective case of aspergers.

Also, wish I could've gone to KCR this past weekend and met you. I was already planning a trip in October and I hope you'll make plans to be there, health and time permitting.

Mark Matis said...

The evil in this country control the hives, the Media (including Fox to an extent, for they are the Rove Republican channel) and the schools. Why would anyone be surprised that their lies about Ruby Ridge and Waco and the rest are taken as gospel???

Wishing you well with your travels.

Dave Noice said...

I'm the guy who invited you to speak.

I apologize if there was some miscommunication on my part.

I believe you sent me a list of items you would need in order for you to consider speaking at the event. I believe you wanted a podium, a sound system and for your speech to be videoed. When I checked with the gentleman organizing the event decided he did not want to have any scheduled speakers.

I sincerely believed I had contacted everyone regarding this decision and, again, apologize if that message never made it to you.


Now, about the Ohio Carry meeting...

I arrived around 7:30pm and was told that my "extremist friend had been run off."

Of course, I had no idea what was going on and was given a 'briefing' that described your rather aggressive reaction to the discussion you mentioned.

I was told that you "jumped up out of your seat and looked like you were going to come across the table" at the gentleman in the wheelchair.

You were variously described as "screaming", "yelling" and "going off on a rant".


Yeah. No.


Taking out 20 years worth of frustration on that group gained you no ground. They weren't the gun-grabbers. They were the 'go to the statehouse and meet with the senators and get in their face pro gun rights' activists.

And you pissed them off.


You could have inserted yourself into the conversation with zero effort and simply offered your insight, experience and knowledge. You could have educated that group of HIGHLY intelligent people and made them aware of facts unknown.

They would have listened. Intently.

You chose to 'snap', instead.


I appreciate your efforts with the 'Fast & Furious' scandal. I also enjoy reading your blog posts and will continue to do so...

...but please drive safely on your trip back to Alabama.


Sincerely-

Dave Noice
www.facebook.com/dave.noice

j said...

NOICE - have you ever met Mike Vanderboegh? Doubtful;. The man is not capable of leaping out of a chair, it takes him a little time just to stand and get his balance. If that is the kind of perversion of truth shared by your pals, I can only suggest that you take some time to reflect on your values. Honesty should be one of them; supporting government murderers at Waco and accusing old men of things they are not capable of doing, does not fall under that heading.

smitty said...

Well, gee, Mr. Noice, forgive us if we are less than charitable regarding those supposedly on our side accepting government propaganda.

I think such folks are unlikely to explore how full of shit they may be.

I think that the narrative of events at this meeting as described to you by your brethren, Mr. Noice, is less credible than that offered by Mr. Vanderboegh.



"They would have listened. Intently."

Seriously?

Since they are so eager to hear new ideas, please tell us their response to your efforts to educate them regarding the truth about the events at Waco in '93.

Dutchman6 said...

W3ell. Mr. Noice, a bit of communication and competence on your part would have gone a long way. Indeed, I would not have wasted considerable time and resources to put you into the schedule nor would I have even had to BE at your meeting. Unfortunate that you did not contact me and that I had to try to track you down.

The idea that I would assault a young man in a wheelchair is ludicrous, insulting and flat stupid. I raised my voice. I did not "scream." I was not out of control. I was righteously pissed. And insofar as "coming at" the young man, I left the room after collecting the papers in front of me and passing him because that was the way out the door.

I will not be going back to Alabama immediately, just as I didn't come to Ohio strictly for your event. You might want to spend your next meeting reviewing Mike McNulty's considerable body of award-winning documentary films on the subject of Waco.

Vanderboegh

Anonymous said...

I think that what seems to have happened is a HUGE misunderstanding.....in regards to both parties involved.

It's a shame that there is now animosity between two groups that (otherwise) would be in agreement.

What a shame on both parties part.

Mike in KY said...

Dave, Carolyn up above said you didn't recognize Mike's name when you got to the meeting and they told you what happened. You said you enjoy reading his posts and will continue to do so. So, which is it? Did you just claim not to know him when questioned? Right before the rooster crowed?

Nobody else there even knew who Mike Vanderboegh is? A freaking Rock Star among gun people? Any pro-gun activist who doesn't immediately recognize that name is woefully uninformed. Have you people heard of David Codrea?

Maybe Dick Metcalf can come and speak at your next meetup. Sounds like he'd be right at home there.

Oh, wait. You probably don't know who he is, either.

Anonymous said...

Sure wish you would have headed West when you left AL. We would have loved to have you speak and stand with us at Bunkerville. Life is too short to waste on fools. Godspeed.

Anonymous said...

I carry in Ohio and have never even heard of this group. Ohioans for concealed carry was the main go to group when the law was being debated. The size of the meeting may have been a tip-off about their relevancy. Look at a red and blue map of Ohio and you will see that the majority of the uneducated live in the urban areas. The smart ones have already left for the countryside.
Best wishes for good health,
Steve

Anonymous said...

We've had so many transplants from that state who always inform us that our building codes and procedures are a joke, and how they do things so much better in Ohio.

Then their work fails to pass inspection.

We call 'em IFO's (Read: Idiots From Ohio) here in TN.

One CSR finally told one such IFO, "If things are so much better there, why don't you go back?"

I envy her. She was nearing retirement and could get away with speaking her mind.

There are exceptions, and exceptional individuals, such as David Codrea, who probably finds OH an improvement over CA.

Mike be careful in Nevada, I'm sure there's plenty of BS there, too - the kind you step in;)

III N TN

Anonymous said...

I think the problem is some of us are like the Spartans in the movie 300. We are ready for war. We want to scream at everyone who contradicts our world view. Not everyone is a despicable evil senator or police officer. Some people are just ill informed. I am sure if you calmy tried to point out what happened, and then said alright agree to disagree that would have been that and you would have been able to stay. You would have planted seeds. Even if this guy was right and the Davidens fired first, were tons of kids justified to burn alive? At the very very least Waco is a gross mis-management and someone's upper level head should have been fried.

Anonymous said...

Dave wrote:

Taking out 20 years worth of frustration on that group gained you no ground. They weren't the gun-grabbers. They were the 'go to the statehouse and meet with the senators and get in their face pro gun rights' activists.


************

I know they certainly believe they are not gun-grabbers, but sadly, insofar as they can't recognize that their Fox News worldview (sans the saintly Andrew Napolitano) on Waco, they are aiding the enemy, and are too ignorant to realize it.

And when inviting someone from out of town to speak, they need to be able to get in direct contact with you AND you should make arrangements for their accommodation. Here is NY, if it requires me to shame others to make contributions so that a Larry Pratt, a Richard Mack, a Stewart Rhodes, or a Mike Vanderboegh can grace us with their knowledge from fighting in the trenches, it's incumbent on the facilitator to facilitate. Mike was doing you a favor, it's your job to make all the arrangements for him. He's a guest. I would be professionally derelict if I ever was so reckless with a guest, be they a client or a speaker/consultant.

And to the others on this thread, this millennial was taught common courtesy, and was able to figure out the Waco lies and the amazing work done by a very small number of people without the luxury of the internet, and we're in their debt.

Shit happens, it's how we recover from it that identifies the character of a man. I implore you to take some time at the next group meeting and enlighten your peers on Mike's background, you owe it to THEM more than you do to Mike, as that's what this is all about, spreading the truth.

COINTELPRO is an abstract concept that a lot of people will have trouble grasping, but it comes down to this premise: what's the most effective way to marginalize the opposition...sticking to the facts, or infiltrating them and making them creating false narratives by controlling both sides.

Anonymous said...

Here's the reality. Local carry groups tend to be a small set of groupthinkers that think they have everything all figured out and get very offended if any "outsiders" dare rock their boat.

Getting truth across to folks about Waco takes time. While I STILL believe Koresch should have been a target it took me a long time to figure out the simple fact. Even when LEO has a legitimate target, it STILL has to follow the rule of law because innocent people get killed needlessly when they don't. At Waco, LEO got in too deep too fast and just wouldn't admit it. People died needlessly.

Interestingly, the Ohio folks acted much like LEO at Waco, minus the killing that is. They circled their wagons around their own even though their own is wrong and they lashed out at Mike in a tyranny of the majority moment. Now, after the fact they try conflicting stories attempting to explain how they did the proper thing when there is no doing so. Oh the irony.

As for the union fudds comment above... ABSOLUTELY! That's EXACTLY how it is in my state. Sad. Sad. Sad.

Vegas Dave said...

Rage on Mike, Rage on....

luagha said...

Funny, I recall hearing at the time that the first 'shots fired' at Waco happened when the BATF goofs jumped off their trailer and one of them discharged shooting himself in the leg.

Did that happen too, or am I mistaken, or is it gone in the mists of time as in 'they aren't admitting to it'?

Or were the first shots against the dogs?

Jonathan OConnor said...

Of course, what he said is gospel, not just his side of what happened.

I was there and frankly if i had been the restaurant manager i would have thrown him out for being loud and obnoxious around other patrons.

Standing up in a restaurant and loudly exclaiming how Nixon could be hanged, and other things about murdering politicians, does not always go down well. Having a reasonable level discussion may have been a better approach perhaps?

But then of course you dont mention how you got loud....

Love how so many hide behind anonymity.

Anonymous said...

Funny thing about the Internet, somehow it causes rational individuals to give a shit about other peoples opinion of them. Heres how I see it, Mike got frustrated for having to track down the idiot who invited him to speak at his groups meeting. Then with that frustration, just beneath the surface, boiled over when some spoiled ignoramus, in a wheel chair lipped off something stupid about something he had no idea what he was talking about. Now stupid is highly contagious and one of the symptoms is it causes people to forget their contribution to The Stupid. If there were any honesty in the whole situation, both sides would quit trying to make themselves more "right" at the expense of the opposing point of view of the same situation. Grow Up! Little Timmy in the wheelchair needs to educate himself as well as every member of Patriot Lite in Ohio of what happened in Waco at what it means to the rest of us on the edge of Civil War. Mike needs to get to Nevada and let this nickel and dime soap opera go, and the rest of us need to get back to what needs to be done, which isn't Manstrating on the Inerwebz!

Anonymous said...

What a bunch of fascist drama queens. Advocate for the murder of a bunch of women and kids by being burned alive, get corrected, then act indignant when corrected. If they cannot take a little self-examination then piss on the lot of them. If you got a little loud, I would say you let them off easy.

I have a feeling that there are more casual posters here on this post than what was at the meeting. If all you do is make t-shirts I can see why no one takes you seriously.

Hey Fudd, how is that Cow Town mag ban going for you?

ExPat Matt

Anonymous said...

Dave Noice = agent provocateur/fibbie snitch?

Dave Noice = bullshit artist

Carolyn Robey-Warren + Anon April 15, 2014 at 8:41 AM + Jonathan OConnor + bulk of COCC = confirmed, unregenerate, incurable FUDDS!!

Sounds like a setup to discredit you. Plus a little harassment by getting you to travel needlessly. Something tells me that Noice's original plan was for you to travel all that way, show up at the planned event and be told that the people running/organizing it had no notion you were coming. In a single stroke you would have been discredited, publicly humiliated and terribly inconvenienced in a single stroke. Noice's sniveling, mealy-mouthed, butter-wouldn't-melt-in-his-mouth, half-assed excuse that he "had contacted everyone regarding this decision and, again, apologize if that message never made it to you." shows either his true intent or his utter lack of competence.

Face it, Dutchman, those people are write-offs. Good riddance. Until/unless someone in authority in a group or someone you personally know and would trust to guard your back in a firefight contacts you about speaking, you should take any invite with a 50 lb bag of salt. Burn me once, shame on the guy who did the burning; burn me twice, shame on me. As for Ohio specifically, any invite David did not personally vet should be viewed as another charley sierra attempt to harass and discredit you.

Paul Kisling said...

So what I am understanding from David and Robyn is that their membership was afraid for their lives from an old man, in poor health who talks loudly, when he called bullshit on bullshit and walked toward them while doing it?

You Spineless Cowards...

Notice that neither one said they disagreed with the their member who postulated that Burning Men, Women, and Children to death was justified hence moral, because they had it coming...


One thing I have never heard Vanderboegh advocate is going after men, women, and children because they "Have It Coming".

If Mike is an extremist for not justifying the murders as some sort of degenerate, justified morality position, then I suspect quite a few people are extremists.

Oh and David? Your group is educated beyond their intelligence.
No further education can help them.

Robyn? Peaceful? Your group thinks killing men, women and children by immolation is justifiable. I don't know but using fire to kill people who break the law as well as their families is the OPPOSITE OF PEACEFUL.

You guys are MONSTERS no different than the people who committed the acts...

Don't believe me? Ask anyone on the street if they believe that burning children to death for the crimes of their parents is justifiable...

Next tell them you think it is and watch how they react to you..

I hope the anti gunners actually get wind of this and rake you over the coals for it. Better yet may the BATF that you love so much bless you with its "gentle" hand...

Anonymous said...

Apparently, Jonathan cannot READ.
you claim mike didn't mention that he got loud. Hmm let's see what mike wrote ok?

" I instantly saw red and blurted out (with what I admit was an absolute lack of tact)"

I understood perfectly that mike was admitting to being loud and even obnoxious! Words have meanings dude.

I ask you openly here right now, Jonathan, if you were invited somewhere, made attempt after attempt to show up, actually do show up, and then the one who invited you plays coy and even a little David copper field mixed in, and after all that you hear some youngster talking about something as if they lived it when they could not have as a simple math exercise, might it be possible that a guy just might call bullshit- when it's actually bullshit? Wouldn't you do so? Easy to say now either way huh? After the fact and out of context and all. So let's try this instead.

Jonathan, was the ATF the aggressor or was it those inside? Was the FBI the aggressor or those inside? Were various local state and federal government agents the aggressors or was it those inside?

Simple questions put to you Jonathan, and I ain't yelling so let's see how you respond. Oh by the way, you can call me Mike.

Oh and seeing how you all let us in on the fact that managers of the joint -didn't- toss Mije V out, you reveal that his outburst couldn't have been what some are trying to portray. I hope you post more because you reveal do much more than you realize......

Jim Klein said...

"While I STILL believe Koresch should have been a target..."

There's plenty of minor folly in this thread, but that one takes the cake...by far. And it's major, not minor. Considering the context, it might be the saddest thing I've read in a long while.

"Even when LEO has a legitimate target, it STILL has to follow the rule of law because innocent people get killed needlessly when they don't."

Ya think? Your problem is that at Waco, they DID NOT have any "legitimate target." Maybe learn what the hell happened there, so you can make your case on facts instead of feelings.

I don't know where all this is leading, but I know this much with absolute certainty---I'm not living through another Waco and doing nothing.

Anonymous said...

My name is Brett and I am the president of Ohio Carry. We are a statewide firearm rights and education organization with chapters in all 5 regions of Ohio. We welcome you to check out our website (www.ohiocarry.org) or our facebook page www.facebook.com/ohiocarry.

I will not be responding to some of the ridiculous and unfounded accusation hurled out behind the mask of anonymity. What I will do is to invite all of you here onto our page and website to see what we are all about. Judge for yourselves. If you find we are not the organization for you, kindly unlike us and move on. But bashing and putting down a firearm rights and second amendment organization serves no legitimate point. If you still feel the need to, we probably weren't going to mesh anyway.

I would also like to take this opportunity to extend an invitation for all of you to any of our walks or events. All Ohio Carry and chapter events can be found on the website under the events calendar. That lists all of them. We went to a special Invite everyone to our all chapters statewide picnic on May 31. We will be raffling off a Smith and Wesson shield 9 mm, Ruger SR40, Rock Island Armory 1911 .45 acp, and a Smith and Wesson 22A .22lr. Admission is free and food is provided by Ohio Carry. We will also be doing giveaways and door prizes throughout the day as well as basket raffles with everything from ammo to holsters to cleaning kits two gift certificates. All are welcome.

Thank you all for allowing me to say my piece and for checking us out before you make judgment. Anyone would like to discuss this further with me, you can contact me at Ohiocarry@yahoo.com

Brett Pucillo
President- Ohio Carry

Anonymous said...

I carry in Ohio and I don't have one of their permits. No one's the wiser.

Anonymous said...

Maybe it's time to require genetic testing prior to voting in Ohio. Sounds like more than a few that you met are short of the generally accepted minimum required to qualify as human.

Unknown said...
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Anonymous said...

Tell us more Mr OConnor.
I've never met Mike. I'd like to hear what was shouted about murdering politicians in a restaurant at dinner; since you were there when that old man went ballistic with all the raving, screaming and such. The first person said members were worried he might jump across the table at a man in a wheelchair. That is something lots of readers of this blog would like to hear.
Sounds like a hell of an incident.


You sound legit. Do you have "meetings" at your store?

Unknown said...
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Fudge said...

@Howie Honkey, my grandpa used to say "fuck 'em in the ass and feed 'em beans."

Anonymous said...

So which is it? Did the person not recognize who mike was as hyphen lady hillary claimed above? Or what thr actual guy just claimed? We already are getting two different versions of events from the same group, which isn't exactly helping their cause.

It sounds to me that this is basically a NRA type group that is fine with all sorts of new laws like BG checks and think the 2nd amendment is just about self defense and conceal carry, and has nothing to do with what the author of the Constitution had to say in Federalist 46. These are the types who get very uncomfortable when discussing what the true intent of the 2nd is beyond just getting govt approval to conceal carry a handgun.

It basically looks as if it is a lot of physically and mentally soft folks who are not used to dealing with how real men debate and argue. They probably belong more at home in a rec level children's soccer game as spectators than actually having any semblance of confrontation.

As for this last poster implying that people are hiding, what exactly would anyone be afraid of saying to your group? I looked at the FB photos and the only thing I would be fearful of would be getting caught in line between one of your members and the buffet table. Do you really think implying that anyone here would be afraid to say the same stuff to a bunch of overweight soccer moms/dads is going to help your argument?

Anonymous said...

"Both sides do agree on some of the president's ideas.

They like the idea of mandatory background checks for anyone who sells a gun and increasing penalties for those who use a gun in a crime or who sell guns illegally."

http://www.10tv.com//content/stories/2013/01/16/columbus-local-reaction-to-gun-control-measures.html

Speaking of embarrassing, this article seems to imply that Jonathan O Connor agrees with the local Bloomberg group about mandatory BG checks aka registration!

Is this true, Mr O Connor? Do you support the Obama/Bloomberg registration scheme as the newspaper claims? No wonder why Mike didn't go over well with these characters....

Paul Kisling said...

@Mr Glockman19man. Unlike my associates and yourself I don't have anything to hide nor do I need to name myself after a gun for personal validation.

So did any of you correct your constituent who was saying that the men, women and children all deserved being burned alive since they had it coming??? Or did you nod in agreement???
Your group sounds neither rational nor peaceful. Just evil.

You guys allow a "friend/fed/psycho/nutjob" talk about mass murder in your so called "family" restaurant. Yet swearing is taboo??? Say what?

How many of you guys have no problem talking about burning children alive, but lose their appetites at the thought of a swear word???

Paul Kisling, Medway, Ohio.

Anonymous said...

Interesting (and quite telling) all of the calls by Ohio Carry to put a name to a poster. What the fuck are you going to do tough guy? Come to my house? Bring a few of your friends with a paper signed by a judge?

No thanks. I can anonymously tell you to go eat a big bag of dicks and you'll have to like it.

Anonymous said...

Well based on what Brett, David and Carolyn have written above, I'd say Ohio Carry consists of a bunch of arrogant, ignorant, mis-informed, hand-wringing, bed-wetting pieces of shit. I sure as hell wouldn't want to be associated with a group like that. I would think that any American that gives two shits about truth, freedom and human rights would be a bit more informed about Waco? It's bad enough the idiot in the chair had no clue what he was talking about - but to have people from that group come here and attempt to defend such stupidity while simultaneously attempting to demean and degrade Mike is nothing short of laughable. You idiots in Ohio Carry are welcome to go ESAD. Please stay in Ohio and I will be sure to stay out of that craphole.

Jim

Anonymous said...

MrGlock19man said...
Why are so many of the comments that are bashing our group made by someone hiding behind Anonymous

lol, thanks for the chuckle MrGlock19man ... IF you ARE really who you say you are (how do we know?)


BTW, I have never met Mike, but I would consider it a privilege of considerable worth if he sat and talked history with my youngun's a bit ... AND, I surely would EXPECT at least a raised voice at points of emphasis

my grandad regularly raised his voice for matters of extreme importance as well

BTW II, caution, somebody with some tech savvy could extract the S/N from the firearm in your avatar pic, you may want to obscure it a bit

regards,

Mark H
Uniontown, Oh
[alas, designated as "anonymous" by the message-post software, as I have no registered account]

Paul X said...

Dave Noice, I wonder if that fellow had said, "The Jews in Treblinka had it coming to them", and Mike responded as he did, would he still have been considered to be an extremist, and thrown out of the meeting? Yet what is the difference, really? Do YOU think the Davidians deserved to be incinerated?

Mike, don't let it bother you. Humans are unbelievable sometimes. One wonders how we managed to move on from the burning of witches.

Anonymous said...

Many of us that are new to the Concealed carry, open carry world do not understand or even KNOW what happened at Ruby Ridge or Waco.

We have preconceived knowledge that we were feed thru the MSM and as our knowledge grows about Fast and Furious (and other illegal government programs) we are turning our gaze backwards to understand other events that in our minds were never thought of in that context.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
"Many of us that are new to the Concealed carry, open carry world do not understand or even KNOW what happened at Ruby Ridge or Waco... We have preconceived knowledge that we were feed thru the MSM "

a) your point should be well taken by those here who have commented harshly, including myself.
In many respects your "Central Ohio Carry" group deserves kudos!
Heck, your Clintonville area of operations in Columbus is an enclave of aging "pro United Nations, central-planner, ex pretend-radicals" who giddily let Katie Couric & Dan Rather formulate their world views for their entire adult lives.
These same folks once proclaimed themselves as "pro-liberty" and refused to trust anybody over 30.
Now, at least a few are frantically scrapping off trendy bumper stickers

b) it's my guess (and a very good one) that Mike's reaction resulted waaaay more research & study of the topics at hand than if Mike had whispered a soft spoken admonition to the young man...
Kudos to Mike!

I see that Ohio Carry is involved in some important community service & education stuff for "The Cause of Liberty", it would seem Ohio Carry also should recognize who literally & willingly puts his ass on the line for "the cause"

in fact, high fives to the Noice guy... if not for his cluster-fuck re the speaking engagement, Mike would not be out in Nevada, in the trenches, with OathKeepers (look it up)

thanks
Mark aka anonymous

Anonymous said...

I notice the gun salesmen and criticizer of those who "hide behind anonymity" has not responded to the newspaper article that stated he was in favor of the Bloomberg/Obama gun registry.

We know what that means!

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
Well based on what Brett, David and Carolyn have written above, I'd say Ohio Carry consists of a bunch of arrogant, ignorant, mis-informed, hand-wringing, bed-wetting pieces of shit. I sure as hell wouldn't want to be associated with a group like that. I would think that any American that gives two shits about truth, freedom and human rights would be a bit more informed about Waco? It's bad enough the idiot in the chair had no clue what he was talking about - but to have people from that group come here and attempt to defend such stupidity while simultaneously attempting to demean and degrade Mike is nothing short of laughable. You idiots in Ohio Carry are welcome to go ESAD. Please stay in Ohio and I will be sure to stay out of that craphole.

Jim

April 16, 2014 at 3:37 PM

Its this kind of unintelligible rhetoric is why some of you that commented on this blog should not only be NOT allowed to own a firearm but be banned from even owning a spoon. Idiots.

Anonymous said...

If anyone of the Anonymous idiots with the cyber balls would like to see for yourself what our group is all about then by all means clime your fat ass out from behind that computer screen come out of your MOM's basement and come to our next meeting at
HomeTown Buffet
5805 Chantry Drive, Columbus, Ohio 43232
Our Facebook pge for the event is
https://www.facebook.com/events/1458154571088270/

Anonymous said...

Okay, Ohio Carry, we get it. You and your mission do not mesh with ours. It happens. If you got a little verbally roughed up than wipe the tears from your eyes, shake the sand out of your vagina and put on your big boy undies.

Being rude to the owner of this blog and then coming here to pimp out your bullshit group must be the best definition of hubris I have ever heard of. Furthermore, the irony of whining about others for posting anonymously yet posting anonymously is just comedic gold. If you want to be judged on the merits of your intentions and words, I would say that they have been beautifully been put on display here. You were measured at the meeting and continue to be found wanting.

Anonymous said...

Its this kind of unintelligible rhetoric is why some of you that commented on this blog should not only be NOT allowed to own a firearm but be banned from even owning a spoon. Idiots.

April 20, 2014 at 7:18 PM


So we have to pass your test of ideological purity in order to exercise our God given right to self-defense?

Your fascist is showing Ohio Carry.

Anonymous said...

I would again encourage a measure of patience with the Ohio Carry folks.
Look, they are likely in intellectual overload having discovered that our natural rights were AFFIRMED by the US Constitution, not "granted" to us by politicians.

Therefore understanding & analyzing pivotal cultural events may be asking a bit much of them at this stage. Heck, they just discovered the concept of responsible firearm ownership, and the concept personal responsibilites for security s such many of the folks they live among and work with are certain that these
guys are evil extremists... hence their emphasis on community service & mushy answers re background checks etc.
They gotta show that they "care" or they will be shunned and cast out of Emerald City (aka, district 1 Capital)

Anonymous said...

To Anonymous at April 20, 2014 at 7:18 PM: "unintelligible rhetoric"? Seriously? The fact that you are not able to process such a clear and concise summation of what took place at that meeting with Mike may explain what utterly repugnant and simply unintelligent dolts it is that comprise Ohio Carry?

To Anonymous at April 20, 2014 at 7:29 PM: "Anonymous idiots with the cyber balls"? Project we much? As you post anonymously and call out people of which you have NO IDEA of whom they are. You guys really are STUPID. I've seen the fat tards that make-up your group of bed-wetting wanna'bes. I've read what you have posted - which betrays what truly ignorant and arrogant and pathetic slobs you are. If I were you, I would restrain myself from calling people out when you have NO IDEA who you are talking to. When will you realize what losers you are stopping digging deeper into the hole you are already in? It's clear you are poseurs who really DO NOT understand what your rights are or why you have them. You are so bereft of any historical context that it boggles the mind, yet you feel absolutely comfortable and justified coming here not only attempting to defend your inexplicable ignorance - but to attack people who are clearly light-years ahead of you when it comes to understanding EVERYTHING regarding firearms ownership and the right to keep and bear such. You are utterly pathetic and should be embarrassed for yourself and your band of diaper-shod slugs. The only thing any of you have demonstrated the "right to carry and conceal" is a drool-cup. Again, ESAD.

Jim

Anonymous said...

My name is Tony Martin I am a SGT.with the Hilliard,Ohio Police Dept.And I am a contributing member of Ohio Carry Central Chapter.I have no idea who the Anonymous people here are from our organization but I do not endorse what has been said here.And as far as what really happened that night I was there and if Mike would have kept on screaming absurdities I would have had him removed by the CPD officer that was outside.He was completely out of line and we do not want a radical former militia member and obviously a listener of Alex Jones.So I am politely asking everyone here to STOP attacking our group we all support the same thing the 2nd Amendment and should all be civil to one another.Our group is relatively new but most of us have been gun owners for a long time.And as for me even though I am a COP I am an Oath Keeper and fully support the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Tony Martin HPD.

Anonymous said...

Tony,

I am a Active Duty Sergeant in the United States Army and you are no Oathkeeper. Your little beta male inspired propaganda rant does you no favors here to explain your case.

Face it, you guys suck. Go hold a bake sale in the Short North and leave the heavy lifting to the adults.

Dont let the door hit your ass on the way out, either.

Anonymous said...

Ohio Carry just keeps digging...

Tony - you have demonstrated exactly what I pointed out previously - your group doesn't get it. You don't want a former militia member? WTF is that? What is a "former" militia member? What exactly is "absurd" about handing someone their ass who doesn't know jack-shit about what happened at WACO or why it is important, especially to a group of folks who portends (or PREtends) to support the 2nd? A listener of Alex Jones? First of all, what's wrong with that? Secondly, you CLEARLY have no idea what you are talking about as Mike pretty-much despises Jones. You have exposed yourself as typical milk sucking establishment weasels who DO NOT UNDERSTAND your rights or your duty as a free American. You are poseurs. You are also so freaking ignorant of the facts it's really quite disgusting. If ANY of you had a clue, you would be embarrassed about what happened at that meeting and further ashamed of the clueless arrogant dreck that have come here attempting to prop-up and further bolster your asinine position on the subject. And amazingly, every time one of you stupid arrogant morons posts here - YOU MAKE IT WORSE!!! STFU already! Stop digging!

Jim

Anonymous said...

One more thing, Tony - you stated "even though I am a cop, I am an Oath Keeper". Further proof that you don't have a clue. Didn't you take the oath when you became an officer? How are the two mutually exclusive? Your statement should read "I am a cop AND an Oath Keeper." Anyway - dome with you idiots.

Jim