Monday, December 1, 2008

"This is as far as the bastards are going."

I took my professional reputation in my hands to debate with someone advertised as a large brain, the humble "MostlyGenius" at the website, found here.

Sayeth MostlyGenius to another Three Percenter on 29 November in the year of our Lord 2008 at 9:57 am:

Not one of the groups on your list represents the situation that the 3% will find themselves in: A scattered group of individuals acting independently without the external support of another nation and without the support of the local populace.

Asymmetric warfare also includes a difference in tactics and the use of political and media assets as well as a difference in the size or capabilities of the belligerents.

While fighting the agents the of the government might seem glorious and moral, the downside is that you have to get the neighbors silence and convince them that either you are acting in their best interest and/or that they have more to fear from you than they do your foes.

My argument is not that the 3% doesn’t have the right goals, it is rather that the tactics they espouse will not improve the rights of citizens or achieve their aims.

To which I replied:

"This is as far as the bastards are getting."

It is risky, I know, disputing someone with the humble title of "MostlyGenius," but I will chance it.

Let us start the ball with your last statement:

"My argument is not that the 3% doesn’t have the right goals, it is rather that the tactics they espouse will not improve the rights of citizens or achieve their aims."

Our aims are:

a. to defend ourselves and our liberty and property at our front door steps. We will not back up any more. It is the feds who will bring the war to us, first.

b. to warn anyone who desires further encroachments upon our liberty and property that there will be consequences for their actions, thus, hopefully, to reduce the threat from becoming reality.

c. to make it plain to every one, prags included, that the time is fast approaching -- thanks to the "authorities" -- when they will have to choose, so they'd better get ready to shoot, shit, or hit the fence.

Our tactics are defined by those aims.

The Founders would be entirely at peace with those aims, and our tactics. If the defense of liberty is not YOUR aim, then I suggest you look in the mirror and quit pretending to the rest of us. How else, other than resistance, will you defend our traditional liberties in the coming period? The possibility of further predations of liberty like an "upgraded" AWB, or the seizure of control over the private sale of all firearms ("Loophole") is upon us. What will you do when they pass and begin to be enforced?

Will you just roll over -- again?

We are done rolling over. We are done backing up. You will have to decide what YOU will do when the feds come to enforce compliance on ME at the point of a gun. I cannot speak for anyone else, but I will resist, also at the point of a gun. If the Olofson case proved anything it proved that you can no longer even count on a fair trial in the federal courts. So, if I refuse to go to federal prison for the crime of being innocent, my only rational response is to sell myself as dearly as possible to prevent others from suffering my fate.

I will die, at least, a free man. And if you do nothing, you will live . . . as nothing. Your choice.

It is our enemies who are in the driver's seat. It is the enemies of the Founders' Republic who will be on the offensive. We Three Percenters are merely in the position of the 82nd Airborne trooper up on the Elsenborn Ridge in December, 1944.

As he dug his fighting position, some refugees from the 106th Infantry Division were streaming past him and his buddies, fleeing the destruction of their division at the hands of the Germans. One of them, overcome by curiousity at the sight of somebody who wasn't running, called out, "Who are you guys?" The paratrooper answered, "I'm the 82nd Airborne, and this is as far as the bastards are getting."

After I posted this I went back to check my memory. It was even better than I wrote MostlyGenius. The refugees were in a tank destroyer and the 82nd man, PFC Martin of the 325th Glider Infantry Regiment, glanced up at them and asked, "Are you lookin' for a safe place?" The tank destroyermen said that they were. To which PFC Martin famously replied, "Well, buddy, just pull your vehicle behind me. I'm the 82nd Airborne and this is as far as the bastards are going."

You can find more information on this incident here.

Remember folks, we are the Three Percent, and this is as far as the bastards are going.


j said...

Does the title 'mostly genius' imply ' no balls'? What was the old poem about those who cry "appease! appease!" ? And - I can speak only hypothetically - but what would be the more difficult resistance force to deal with - a centrally coordinated, nationally linked force... or a totally unpredictable body of individuals or small groups in innumerable locations, functioning below the radar, with one common goal shared by all?

Anonymous said...

I left this post at the flippin' "AlmostGenius'and instead of being automatically posted as before it's now sidetracked into moderation. I think he's hiding. ;-)

"Mike Vanderboegh
December 2nd, 2008 at 12:59 am Your comment is awaiting moderation.

O MG, I notice you’ve answered other’s posts but not mine. From your comments to them I gather you’ve still not looked deeply into that mirror. What say you?"

Jay21 said...

I had been involved is a slight debate with him over the holiday on that very thread. Glad to see you chimed in. I was unable to get him to understand the 3% do not want to speak for everybody ONLY US as INDIVIDUALS in a common goal. I would like you did answer each of his points, then they would change and I would answer them, never able to get my point across that retreat is no longer an option, resolve is. Excellent response Mike.

Anonymous said...

Hmmm, it's almost like half the internet doesn't know or remember what Fort Sumter is. Maybe a new rule/disclaimer/motto is needed so people will figure out you don't want to start a war?

Anonymous said...

Allow me to argue MG's position for a moment:

If your goal is to resist successfully or die resisting, it is very likely you will succeed. My goal however is resist successfully without dying. That may be harder but I find it preferable. In that light, the sort of things that have been talked about in 3% circles are not of clear general usefulness. It seems likely to me that an intelligently orchestrated police action could nibble away at the 3%, causing a shootout here and there, which would always get reported as "just another wacko going nuts with guns", and without sparking any kind of general discontent. For example: the first chapter of Absolved seems to me to be extremely optimistic in terms of overpreparation on the target's part, underpreparation on the cops' part, and all the luck going one way. I don't see a real world incident playing out that way, particularly after the first few shootouts - they'd be readier. And it would be a very unusual town that wasn't split in opinion about what exactly happened and whether he should've "just obey the law" or to respect the officers of the court or what have you.

The thing is, many people _support_ police departments and the FBI. Yes they grumble about tickets but they can't imagine doing without the very organs of state power that are going to be the 3%'s biggest opposition. This leaves the 3% in the default position of being a guerrilla force amid a neutral to hostile population - which is simply terrible.

The question is not how to die for your beliefs. Anybody can do that. Carl Drega did, and look what that accomplished. Willingness to die is useful but not sufficient.

defcon1 said...


Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

You design a "3%" flag and I'll hang one on my blog, sir.

The Gunslinger said...

I feel as though I have come home.

My fury at, and seemingly isolated recognition of, the outright fascism of the current democrats, (and the compliance of wimpy Republicans), and their obvious, infernal, intention to seize power, un-bothered by mere Constitutionality has left me frustrated and feeling rather like Cassandra.

Thank you for being here.

The day I made up my mind that if they came for my guns I would actually shoot it out with the police, was the day I knew I had gone over some pasture fence that "normal" citizens don't approach.

Nice to know I'm not alone out here in no-man's land.

3%? Hell yeah! That's good enough for me!