Tuesday, February 17, 2015

Modern Rifleman’s Comments on ATF Framework Proposal (M855 Ban)

In light of these facts, ATF should take two significant actions. The first is that the agency should immediately withdraw the proposed framework referenced in the opening of this letter. The second action should be prompt removal of the armor piercing classification for M855/SS109 as the projectile does not meet either statutory definition within 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(17)(B).


Submariner said...

From page 15 of the BATFE document:

"ATF recognizes that this ammunition is widely available to the public. Because it is legally permissible to possess armor piercing ammunition under current law, withdrawing the exemption will not place individuals in criminal possession of armor piercing ammunition. However, with few exceptions, manufacturers will be unable to produce such armor piercing ammunition, importers will be unable to import such ammunition, and manufacturers and importers will be prohibited from selling or distributing the ammunition. ATF is specifically soliciting comments on how it can best implement withdrawal of this exemption while minimizing disruption to the ammunition and firearm industry and maximizing officer safety."

It's not a proposal - has anyone not read the last sentence of this paragraph?

They're not asking for input on whether or not they should do it; they already decided. They're asking for input on how to enact it as "smoothly" as possible.

In layman's terms: We're going to f*ck you in the a$$, how can we f*ck you in the a$$ as "smoothly" as possible?

Anonymous said...

The parallels with the 1770s become more stark each day.

The tyrannous attempts at seizing of powder and shot is being repeated ...


PO'd American said...

I along with the rest of America would like to know how "unelected burrocrats" get to "make" law. The BATFE needs to be eliminated.

Rule 303 said...

This is a decision that was meant to be disobeyed.

1. Set up fully licensed and legal ammo manufacturing.
2. Produce ammo to MX855 Specs.
3. Sell it. Make $$$
4. Take ATF to court when they shut you down, fuck them in the ass.

Anonymous said...

In my own mind, the moment I heard about this I thought to myself this is an eerily creepy reminder that the British tried to do fundamentally the same thing, with the big difference being that they sent in soldiers instead of Eric Holder. The response from the colonist's side was pretty clear, and pretty immediate. What now do we do? Mike V. , you advocate we wait and watch and let them hang themselves by getting it into the Supreme Court. I get that. We must always occupy the moral high ground. My worry is that this action will get stalled over and over. And until that happens, the Atf has total impunity and free rein to do whatever it is they wish.There are no accidents, sir. I see a lot of people questioning the timing of all this action as of late. They have a plan and agenda. They must be close to it's endgame and we are starting to see their mask finally come off. Whether this is being done out of desperation or without any fear of reprisal I leave to the rest of you to judge. By the time we get into a court room that actually will do something meaningful it may be too late for that option to bear any fruit. Why is Patrick Henry always on my mind? Our chains are being forged link by link in Washington D.C. even as we sit here. I look at my daughter and am ashamed. She hasnt even barely started Kindergarden and she doesnt know the freedoms these evil swine are trying to rob her off. When she is old enough to ask me about it I fear she will look in the vault at my rifle and ammunition along with all the gear and she will ask me in a heartbroken voice, " Why didnt you do something with this when you had a chance? ". What would I say to her? It is a question that burdens my soul greatly. I have trained for over ten years to be the best I can be. I will never be more ready to do what must be done if I am called upon to do so. I just want to know if my trepidation is valid or if I am taking things out of the context. Like most folks I just want to go to work, be left alone to raise my kids and do no harm unto no one. The fact these traitorous assholes are being paid out my own pocket to cut my own throat only galls me more. - The Bellevue Headhunter

Anonymous said...

Hmmm...armor piercing....You guys know, of course, that it's legal to shoot carbon steel projectiles out of a smooth bore shotgun, right?

So we need to develop a tungsten steel dart with stabilization fins, wrapped in a 12 gauge sabot that weighs in at less than one ounce, and put enough hot pistol powder behind it to accelerate it to 2000 fps.

There's your legal armor piercing round.

Informed42 said...

As the article points out, the ammo IS NOT ARMOR PIERCING by any definition, even ATF's !! Look up Green Tip Steel Core in 55 grain and 62 grain. It's NOT Armor Piercing.

As far as the same old, lame old
excuse of 'officer safety' goes,
I'm not aware of body armor less than Level 4 that will defeat large caliber or high speed rifle rounds.

In fact, I'm not aware of any Level 3 or 3A that will defeat the FN 5.7 X 28 rounds. That's why so many foreign law enforcement agencies have switched to them for side arms.

Anonymous said...

A nice writeup, but I am afraid it misses several points:
1. ATF wants to ban M855 ammo. It is that simple. Their "reasoning" is an ordinary lie just like *everything* they said about Fast and Furious was. Corresponding and reasoning with them is a waste of time. They are not stupid. They are not children who got shiny pieces of metal with a green painted tip and are now soliciting opinions on what is it and can they build castles with it?!
2. They understand that current economic policies will eventually lead to the blowup of the proportions not seen on this continent ever before. Debt-financed socialist paradises must end that way. They always do. They will end-up on the receiving end of M855, so why not ban it?
3. They have every intention to use M855 - on the filthy peasantry, that is you, and because of "officer safety" on your family too!
4. On a positive note, M855 will be plentiful in the place where it will matter the most-battlefield. You'll have to pick it up from a dead enemy. Some risk is involved, but price will be good.

Anonymous said...

All shots should be head shots anyway, where ever, and when ever possible. M193 will do a better job.

Someone in government is setting themselves up to get rich. All the M855 ammo in stock currently will not be destroyed, it will be sold and shipped out of the country to supply others wars.

Officer safety my ass....their life is not worth a penny more than mine or yours. They just want more impunity to kill you and I at will.

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