Saturday, June 19, 2010

Taking "Hell NO!" for an answer. Gee, whiz. Some people don't like to be asked unconstitutional questions by prying nanny state lackeys. Who knew?

Mighty Casey at the bat. Daniel Hadley, age 41, after he took a bat to the arm of an insistent, pestering follow-up census worker in my old home town, Marion, Ohio.

My thanks to several Threepers who brought my attention to this story and the one below.

Pity the poor census takers. Note that the WaPo doesn't mention the rapist census takers, or or the woman killed by cops when she tried to make the late-night census taker get the hell off her property.

As far as Citizen Hadley above, the Marion Star reports:

Marion County Prosecuting Attorney Brent Yager said he filed a felony complaint Wednesday for a second-degree felonious assault charge, and Marion Municipal Court Judge Teresa Ballinger set Hadley’s bond at $100,000.

Yager said prosecutors had spoken with Census Bureau representatives Wednesday, who said a female worker who had gone to the Farming Street residence to collect information before was turned away. Tuesday, the male worker was making a second attempt to collect information.

I guess he should have taken "Hell NO!" for an answer.

I fail to have any sympathy for these minions. I should, I know. As a Christian I really should. But I cannot. One more thing for me to answer for someday.


An unexpected result for some census takers: the wrath of irate Americans

By Carol Morello
Washington Post Staff Writer
Sunday, June 20, 2010; A04

This is the scary season for the nation's census takers.

Since they began making follow-up house calls in early May, census takers have encountered vitriol, menace and flashes of violence. They have been shot at with pellet guns and hit by baseball bats. They have been confronted with pickaxes, crossbows and hammers. They've had lawn mowers pushed menacingly toward them and patio tables thrown their way. They have been nibbled by ducks, bitten by pit bulls and chased by packs of snarling dogs.

Some days, being cursed at seems part of the job description.

So far, the Census Bureau has tallied 379 incidents involving assaults or threats on the nation's 635,000 census workers, more than double the 181 recorded during the 2000 census. Weapons were used or threatened in a third of the cases.

Now, with just three weeks to go in the door-knocking phase of the count, the number of census takers has dwindled, and the remaining households are the toughest.

While most homeowners have received census takers graciously, some say they have been surprised at the degree of anger exhibited by Americans who consider them the embodiment of intrusive government.

"I came across loads of hostility," said Douglas McDonald, who summoned police in Deltona, Fla., after a tug-of-war with an irate homeowner over a census form. The homeowner threw his ripped half in the toilet.

McDonald, 70, a District native who retired from the Labor Department after 30 years as an investigator, said he wasn't prepared for the level of anti-government fervor he encountered.

"There's so much anger and bitterness, with people losing their homes and their jobs," said McDonald, who eventually quit. "They're not too fond of the government. They don't want to talk to you."

Sherri Chesney, 46, said she was cursed and spat at during follow-up visits in Houston. One day, she encountered a woman working in her garden. Chesney showed her census badge, she said, prompting the woman to launch into a tirade: "I don't need the blankety-blank government snooping in my business." Then she threw a metal patio table at Chesney, who escaped injury by ducking.

"I was stunned, I really was, that America is so mad at the government," said Chesney, who no longer works for the census. "People don't know what it's like out there. It's scary and dangerous, and it's not worth my life."

Census officials say they do not consider anti-government sentiment more widespread than usual this year. But Fernando Armstrong, the Philadelphia regional census director responsible for Maryland and the District, said it seems to be more vociferous.

"It's the degree of passion they have," he said. "When they don't want to participate, they really don't want to participate."

In the Washington area, the threats made to census takers have been infrequent, and no one has been harmed.

Some of the attacks elsewhere represent random violence, such as a robbery at knifepoint in Richmond, Va., and a carjacking in Connecticut. In some situations, the job turned unexpectedly dangerous, as for the Baltimore crew leader who was fatally shot seven times while sitting in his car and the Wisconsin census taker who knocked on the door of a man who tried to drag her into his apartment.

Other workers were beset by mean-tempered animals. Wendy Soto, who was knocking on doors in California, still can't move two fingers after being attacked by a pit bull that pushed open a security door.

Among the more troubling were incidents that arose from residents' seething resentment that anyone from the government would seek their personal information.

Some people pointedly mentioned President Obama.

While conducting follow-ups in an upscale Seattle neighborhood, Grover Ellis said he came across a woman who considered him an agent of Obama, not the U.S. government.

"The idea of the census just enraged her," said Ellis, 64, stressing that the overwhelming majority of people he met were welcoming and responsive. "The way she saw the census, she was required to help Obama. And she wasn't going to do anything to help out Obama."

Police have been dispatched after confrontations between census takers and property owners who posted No Trespassing signs. As federal government employees, the census takers are not breaking the law by disregarding the signs.

But try telling that to a homeowner with a crossbow.

In a rural part of California's Nevada County northeast of Sacramento, two census workers told authorities that a man ordered them off his land. He mentioned his submachine gun, then followed them down the drive with a crossbow in hand. No charges were brought against the resident, the sheriff's department said.

A homeowner in Marion, Ohio, called police, saying he had just used his baseball bat against a stranger on his property. The perceived interloper was a census taker who told police the resident flew off the handle as soon as he mentioned the word census. The census taker was struck in the forearm, warding off blows from the aluminum bat. The resident was charged with felonious assault.

Dallas regional director Gabriel Sanchez said occasional encounters with dogs and protective property owners are par for the course in any census.

"It's not that people are waiting to gun down a government worker or waiting to assault a census worker," he said. "Some people have a strong need for privacy and being left alone. I'm sure they would treat the FedEx man the same way."

Soto, the pit bull victim, says census takers should be permitted to carry weapons, such as pepper spray, to ward off harm.

"If I'd had pepper spray in my pocket, I probably would have had a good chance of not losing my hand," said Soto, 38, who was earning $15 an hour and saving for a vacation with her children and a used car.

The dog bit Soto in the stomach, leg and hand. The census is paying for her doctor's bills, medication and replacement clothing. She doesn't know when she will be physically able to return to her regular job as a special-education teacher's aide.

Steven Jost, a spokesman for the Census Bureau, said it is unlikely that the policy prohibiting census workers from carrying weapons will be rescinded. After the 2010 census is completed, officials will examine all incidents to determine whether changes are needed to reduce risks, for both workers and the public. The number of verified incidents might go down after analysis.

Chesney, for one, won't be back for another census unless she's offered an office position.

"I want to help my country," she said. "I want us to have funding for schools, and all the things that are involved with the census. But I'm not putting my life at risk."


Brutus said...

Christ did not set us free only to go into bondage to the State and its goons. When the State and its goons stop being representatives of God and His righteousness ... then you have no moral duty to feel sorry for them other than to knock on their door ... tell them the error of their ways ... and ... if they refuse to listen ... walk away and shake the dust of their house from your shoes.

The Founders of this once republic certainly understood that. They didn't fret and have sympathy over those who put them in bondage ... they shot them.

Interesting article for those interested:


Dennis308 said...

As far as I´m aware of the census worker hasn´t been to my place I guess the fence,locked gate,three dogs, and the trespassers will be shot sign might have something to do with it.


Divemedic said...

Now that the membership of the House of Representatives is fixed at 435, there is no Constitutional reason to have a census.

The reasons they give, apportionment of funds and the like, were never provided for in the COTUS.

What the census is REALLY used for is Gerrymandering districts to keep the powers that be in charge.

Anonymous said...

The House may be fixed at 435, but how they are apportioned is not. Indications are that people are moving away from socialist states like California and New York to freer states. The big states are expected to lose representative.

I am amazed at how many III percenters are so afraid of being asked a few questions (which they could refuse to answer) as part of being counted. I suppose they would rather have our "glorious leader" Obama assign the numbers of representatives for each state.

Anonymous said...

"As federal government employees, the census takers are not breaking the law by disregarding the signs."

Anonymous said...

I love hearing all the adds on radio about how we would all be babbling idiots of we didn't get all the information from the census. Like, "how on earth would we survive without the federal dollars we get from the census...". And I especially love how they use children by sending info home to their parents so that the kids can scold their parents about how important it is.

We live in quite despotism. I'm sure this fraction of a percent of violence will be used to justify arming census workers, or proving armed escort.

These census workers are just useful idiots. They don't care about what is constitutional or what is not. All they know is that their handlers have pumped them full of BS and that they have governmental "authority" backing them. Whatever. They have picked their side. Ignorance or intent, the effect is the same.

Anonymous said...

I filled out the form, mailed it, and still received a phone call from a census twit wanting to ask more questions.

Told the woman you already have the information, DO NOT CALL ME. Then hung up.

Waste of freaking money and time for these .gov maroons.

Matt said...

I definitely treat the Fed-ex man nicer than the census taker. He brings something I asked for, while the census asks for something I don't want to give.

Guess I got lucky with my census taker. She showed up while I was doing yard work, pistol on my hip. Told her the answer was "2" and that's all the info she was getting, as that was all the Constitution provided for. Talked to her for about 20 minutes, found out she feels about how I do, but had to take the job because her husband is out of work and she just got done with school. I let her know that if one of her superiors came out, they wouldn't get as friendly of a reception, so she filled out a refusal to answer sheet, and no one came back.

While I understand the sentiment about wanting to ward workers of the .gov off your property, I really wish people would use some discretion. Then again, maybe the .gov will take a hint . . . But I'm not holding my breath.

Arming census workers? Yeah, just what we need, more federal employees with guns and a perceived sense of authority. For some reason, I don't think that would end well.

Anonymous said...

I fail to see how assaulting a census worker makes you a hero or protector of the constitution. If you wanted to find some way to make your organization look bad to average Americans I think you would be hard pressed to do better then you have with this issue. I would no more assault a census worker then I would a girl scout selling cookies at my doorstep. If you insist on using the census as a way to demonstrate your belief that the questions are unconstitutional why not limit yourself to that and do it politely and without assaulting innocent people.

Hollywood said...


I guess I'm not getting it.... Some stranger shows up at my property, and is apparently unarmed?

What is the correct action?
A) Call the police, and wait with hand in coat pocket on J-frame S&W?

B) Figure out he is from the census, tell him/her the # of people in the house (only that) and say have a "nice day"

C) Attack another human being, for no real cause.

Come on, this is a Felony Assault and this guy is an idiot.

Divemedic is wrong, the number maybe fixed at 435, but how those seats are proportioned does change. And this is a very early mandate from our Founding Fathers to do this.

I just put the number "4" in the blue box and sent it back. No one has come to see me, so I assume that was sufficient.

Anonymous said...

Take a look at the mug shot of the victim at the top of the article. He's just a little fella--5 feet, 3inches--and here comes this hulking Federal agent ready to run him in if he answers the questions wrong. Don't blame him for using a baseball bat; he didn't have a gun.

Anonymous said...

Fortunately, my three follow-up run-ins with the census enumerators were peaceful, albeit pointed. They asked, I refused to answer. I was able to quote to them "chapter and verse" on the Constitution about counting the number of people (which I HAD answered and sent in originally) for representation in Congress, but nothing else. I finally sent them away disappointed saying that if they wanted to come back and try again, they needed to bring a copy of THE LAW (not rules, regulations or suggestions) and possibly a warrant to make me answer all the PC questions.

But thanks for the warning. With the normal time for follow-ups closing, I now expect further "visits" or telephone calls. I wonder, what parts of the word NO don't they understand?

B Woodman

DB said...

Umm, all you have to do is ask them to leave your property once, after that they are illegally trespassing. And according to my local game warden no trespassing signs do count. However it would have been much easier for people to just put a 00 in the # of residents field and sending the form in telling them the property is vacant.

Black Ice said...

"Police have been dispatched after confrontations between census takers and property owners who posted No Trespassing signs. As federal government employees, the census takers are not breaking the law by disregarding the signs."

Oh, really? Since when does signing up to be a census temp entitle you to disregard the 4th Amendment, among others...?

Doc Enigma said...

This is chalked up next to that little 7 year old girl in Detroit....we are absorbing another we get closer and closer....

Anonymous said...

i work for the census. all they ask you is names, sexes, ages, you are of hispanic origin, race, if you live or stay anywhere else, if anyone is temporarily staying with you and if you own your house, have a mortage, rent it or stay there without paying rent.

I agree with freedom and liberty, don't tread on me, etc, but census workers are just everyday americans who need jobs. they're not out to get you.

Toastrider said...

Sidenote: I recall Chairman Zero bragging about the 430,000 new jobs created... except he left how most of those (about 410,000) were census related.

But yeah. Be polite, be firm, but don't escalate unless you can get away with it.

Anonymous said...

Anon 3:55,
As has been pointed out repeatedly, just those "few" questions are too many. All that is required is the number of residents. Period.
Again, what part of NO don't you understand. If you persist on being a pest, you will get swatted. Take the hint.
If there is a legal justification for all the intrusive questions, then let the law enforecment take care of those who refuse to answer.

Quit being a useful idiot tool, parroting the dot gov responses. You may live longer.

B Woodman

Mike Gallo said...

Yes, before asking people those questions, perhaps census workers should be asking themselves "what could this information possibly be used for if not for redistribution of wealth and political power based on race," and "why ask the questions if the information isn't going to be used?"

debrarae said...

The problem with census workers is (now they are controlled by the WH) they are INDEED the TOOLS for Obama!

And the problem with the 'expanded' census is that it does violate our right to privacy.

Obama CLAIMS to 'care' about the Middle class .... yet with the CRAP that's contained within this 'expanded' form ...... it's targeting us for even MORE OVER Taxation (of course WITHOUT Representation)

debrarae said...

SO since ANOYMOUS you are so UNAFRAID .........why not POST A NAME?

IN short I am NOT AFRAID! I posted MY NAME when I posted .......while YOU 'sit' HIDING in the shadows...

Please note .......when the census worker approaches me with the long form census form .....and 'asks' me to fill it out ...

I'll tell them that I'll fill it out when the POTUS presents 'his long form birth certificate' ....

And if they don't like that answer they can speak to the ACLJ because I will NOT SUBMIT TO THEM or TO YOU!!!!!!!!!

YOU are the COWARD ...........NOT US!

rustynail said...

At 15:55 on June 20, an Anonymous poster said: "i work for the census. all they ask you is names, sexes, ages, you are of hispanic origin, race,... .

... census workers are just everyday americans who need jobs. they're not out to get you."

During WWII census bureau data was used to locate and intern American citizens of Japanese ancestry. See Information can be and has been misused by government.