The "edited" video shows the killing of Lavoy in all the detail of the unedited version. The big difference is that the "edited" video is available in 2 High Definition formats, 720 and 1080, so you can view in crystal clear detail.
Edited version linked below. Truck hits the snowbank at 5:50 mark.
Soo... By FBI standards, If i have a confrontation with a Individual and they Reach into/around/or near wear a Handgun maybe concealed... I am free to use Lethal Force.
People will say what they will, mostly those who A) have no idea what any of this is about (in a general sense that government today is operating, unquestionably, outside its delegated authority and towards ends that are diametrically opposed to what was Declared and what is Constituted) and B) have never actually watched this video.
Here is the fact of the matter, people were PISSED OFF that Citizens dared stand firm in protest to the whole damn thing,that there IS NO remedy outside combining our rights together to get the attention to the fact that even when we are in the right, government refuses to RELENT and will rise to the level of outright murdering a Citizen who calls out their evil ways.
Agree or disagree about this being the right thing at the right time in the right place, Take Note - The United States Government just engaged in a planned, execution of a Citizen. They set up a roadblock on something of a curve and their intent was clear. Someone was going to die. And someone did. There had to be an example made, so other do not get the idea that this kind of thing would be tolerated.
They went so far as to have a guy jump in front of a vehicle to claim the ability to turn this into a shooting affair.
Say what you want but I know this to be absolutely true. There was NO REASON to shot that man. The plain truth is.....Government just committed intentional MURDER. And they will get away with it too.
They murdered that man. They murdered that man. They murdered that man.
So it occurs to me that since the fibbies put this out, they believe this video exonerates the crime.
I don't fucking think so. What complete and total douchenozzles! I am sure he was going for a gun, or something, yeah, that's it. LaVoy Finicum was murdered, right there, in front of all of us!
I'll tell you what this video tells me. It tells me just how important intel in the field is. In times of serious ( and I repeat, SERIOUS) armed contact with a bureaucracy, knowing where a roadblock is well ahead of an maneuver could change the outcome dramatically in times of all out civil war. I'm imagining two 4-man fire squads in each side of the woods well off the road lending a bit of surprise to the bureaucratic executioners before the dastardly deed. And also testing just how well armored a chopper tail rotor is or isn't. ( now watching that video would be a hoot!)...But back to the reality at hand - the Bundy's were led into this roadblock by forces looking to set them up for the fall. I find it hard to believe their planning could be this bad. If this really was just poor planning, then I'm glad I'm not part of any "militia" they're leading..
We need sound. Were they shooting at him when his hands were up? I would go for my weapon if that were the case. If you are going to die anyway might as well take one with you.
All the corruption you are willing to accept and live with. If you think you are free, then why ....can you be executed by self justifying thugs?
I would ask again, are you FREE or just willing slaves to the criminal system ruling you, biding time until your privileges are REVOKED in their ENTIRETY?
Trial by FED GOV promoted execution....that's Progress I guess (sarc off)
Why only one camera angle? The FBI knew how closely they were being watched here - I cannot believe there is only one angle on this event. They chose the footage that they could fabricate a narrative about. Need a FOIA request and full investigation on this murder of a patriot. No more free Wacos!
Where is the body cam footage. You can't make a decent judgement of what happened from an airial video. Was he reaching for something or had he just been shot in the mid section? His hands were in the air and if any of us had just been shot we would have the same reaction to grab our belly where the bullet was. This video opens more questions not less.
Did he get shot before or after his hands dropped? He was clearly just tryi g to evade and didn't want to have a shootout. If he did he would have stopped and used his rifle. Sometimes excessive force and threat is what gets people killed. The FBI is at least guilty of that...
And why shoot at the vehicle? How many shots were fired? We are missing a HUGE amount of evidence with this video.
The first thing that is wrong with all of this is that it was as Mike said, from the beginning, the wrong place, and the wrong issue. The place was isolated and virtually "undefendable", the government could easily set up a "perimeter", and control it, and did! The two men had agreed to go back to jail and they specifically stated that they did NOT want this kind of help. That removed virtually any/all of it's "moral components" from being defendable......in the court of public opinion!
Many of us just knew that it was going to end more or less this way. In fact I am flabbergasted that the government did not kill everyone in the truck, as they would have defended it by saying the truck was trying to run one or more of them down, thus justifying the use of deadly force.
This incident was deliberately set up by the government, and from their point of view, it was a classic intercept and great way to end this in one fell swoop. The guys that occupied this place could not have been very smart as we have been saying since the start. The government had complete control over what happened here, from the beginning! First of all they had great intel. This intel told them that ALL the leadership of the group was going to be on the road, in 2 vehicles, travelling through very isolated wilderness in winter conditions and would have virtually no way to escape them on foot. The rest was easy. Setting the second road block up on a blind curve was excellent thinking, because it was blind, the terrain made it near impossible to get away on foot, and by being there, the occupiers would have had to RUN from the first stop thus giving the government a much more easily defendable reason for the use of deadly force, if need be!
Quite frankly it was insane to run from the first stop! When they did, they set in motion what happened at the last stop. When Finnicum got out of the truck he had his hands high in the air which was good. At some point he took both hands and reached down to his waist area and was shot. Some are saying maybe he was wounded and reach down to put his hands on that place. Maybe he did, but maybe he went for a gun. How will WE ever know the truth of that?
You can bet that we will NEVER Know the truth as the government controls ALL the evidence and will only release that which makes their case! I would like to see the autopsy report but know I won't most likely. I would like to see the results of a forensic examination of how many times he was wounded and in what order, but don't expect to see that either. When you fight by the government's rules you are almost defeated before you start.
The government should not own any more land then is necessary for government buildings and the like, and military bases. They own way too much now, and they use it against the citizens any time they can. It is subject to exploitation by those politically connected and many citizens have been abused for along time. This is a great issue to debate and argue about. But the way these guys went at this they were bound to lose from the start!
My dad taught me that you need to PICK your fights....and the PLACES for them....in order to have a chance to prevail. This was neither of those. I deeply regret the loss of life and am angry that the government set it up so that that would likely happen. But they have total control of the evidence and the information flow to the media. It is clear that public opinion was heavily against those guys who occupied the place, and was from the beginning.
Next time I hope those inclined to "make a stand" will pick a better "issue, time and place" and maybe the outcome will be much more to our liking!
In the initial stop it appears there were two flashes (gunshots...?) immediately prior to LaVoy driving off...
Open disclosure and establishing the truth seems to require:
Release of video/audio of the initial 'traffic stop' of both vehicles
Clearer video would help
ALL other body or dash videos should be revealed
Audio is required in order to hear spoken words as well as gunfire/explosions
On another note:
Remember the film re-make of Manchurian Candidate with Denzel Washington?
At the end of the film one observes video of Washington's character being 'adjusted' to appear as someone else.
My question:
Has digital photography/video advanced to the point that created images are impossible-or extremely difficult-to detect as having been manipulated?
Not too many years ago, my business being partially the sale of industrial photo products, I remember manufacturers field reps saying that digital imagery was nearing the point of better resolution or quality than traditional silver films.
Two days-working 24hrs/day-would probably be enough time to 'adjust' imagery/audio in order to enable the fed.gov to control what the public sees and thereby steer public reaction in a favorable to fed.gov direction.
I totally agree with every sentiment here. I've reviewed this video 20 times..and frame by frame from 9:05 through 10:65 and here is what I see. Observations. Contrary to what the FBI would have you believe by reports via their "analysis" and on ground statements of agents and Oregon State police...@9:13 it's BLINDINGLY OBVIOUS, the truck had just rounded a bend in the road only to find a roadblock approx 100 feet ahead, far shorter than he could have stopped at the speed he was going. No wonder he swerved. Any one in their right mind would have done the same. If you believe the FBI reports " he tried to go around the roadblock to escape", that is a bald faced lie. He tried to keep from being killed by driving the truck into a snowbank. He had NO CHOICE but to do what he did. Frankly, it's too bad he didn't crash. You KNOW why. Moreover..think what would be going through your mind at the instant the truck stopped. I know what I would be thinking. They intend on killing me. ...right here...right now. However, Finicum exited truck with both hands extended outwards. Not an aggressive act in my universe. It was only the moment when he must of realized..they were out to kill him, that he dropped his hands and turned. Why he turned I don't know. Maybe he heard the hidden agent coming out of the forest.
Furthermore, as far as I can surmise, whoever decided to place the roadblock in that exact location, was an bloody idiot. First off, he placed every single agent in jeopardy as anyone with one neuron between their ears could conclude a vehicle rounding that corner would not have time to stop. So, there was only TWO possible outcomes. (a)..he crashed directly into the roadblock..or (b), he crashes into the snowbank. There was NO WAY he could have gone around it. Even a moron can see that. Either way, agents could have been injured or killed, as the video clearly shows. This tells me something. Moreover, an agent clearly comes out of the forest with a weapon pointed. That tells me they had snipers off to either side. This was a setup. A trap. At a place where NO reporters or other video would have a chance to refute a story propagated by the Oregon State police/FBI. As it is, this video, as opposed to the FBI "analysis" of the video, is bullshit. You can't tell didley squat what Finicum was doing with his hands when he was shot.
Conclusion. This was a trap intended to result in one of two scenarios, both of which were fully intended to kill one or more of the occupants. Hence snipers hidden behind trees to left side of vehicle, of which said sniper emerges and immediately shoots L in back. All I know from viewing this video is the FBI lies through their teeth. They planned an execution. Period.
and how does bretzing know that? oh, that's right. according to victoria sharp, ryan payne got out of the car a minute or two earlier and was arrested before it took off hauling ass for this roadblock -- after he dodged a bullet! this "incredible" and "amazing" guy! ...who very likely reported to the people who paid him to be there who was in the car and what arms they had on them.
I would personally like to thank the Feds for posting a video showing "legal" ambush/assassination techniques. Notes have been taken... I wonder how they would feel if they were the ones squeezed in the middle. Hummm...
Deplorable monopoly of violence as usual ! The bought and paid for goons never had any pride ,integrity nor guts. This citizen was murdered pure and simple ! Behind enemy lines Ct.
In the original traffic stop, the truck was fired upon. At that point, Lavoy was under assault without cause, and was in defensive mode. He drove away not realizing there was a road block. He tried to make it around the road block likely because he assumed that was their best chance of not facing trigger happy feds. After getting his truck stuck, he quickly exited the truck with his hands up. Likely to lessen the chances of the passengers being struck by bullets. He walked clear of the truck with his hands up. Once he was squared up with the LEO who had drawn on him, he dropped his hand to his coat. It is likely that shots were already fired at him at that point because he was verbally aggressive. They could have been non lethal rounds of some sort, but he still would have heard the report of the weapons. Whether he was hit or not is irrelevant. If he had a 9mm in his pocket, now was the time for self defense. And if I am wrong and no projectiles whatsoever were fired until the moment he reached down to his hip, then it was definitely a suicidal act. And he should have known better than to give the LEO's a reason to start shooting b/c no matter how far from the truck he was, there was a chance the passengers would be fired upon. He also may have believed they would be all fired upon anyway, but as the leader he should have had a cool enough head to surrender completely unless fired upon, especially with a teenage girl in the vehicle.
We don't know if he reached for his coat before being fired upon.
Considering the times we live in, and the LEO mindset, it is honestly debatable and only audio will tell the story. Without bias, I believe it is more probable than not that he was fired on because he kept walking with his hands up being verbally aggressive.
Strange that the FBI press spokesman focuses on all the non lethal rounds that were used.
Why didn't they use non lethal to take down Lavoy? The first to approach him used lethal force without a doubt.
"Of the dozens of cameras there, this is the least incriminating video"
Exactly. We know what will happen when we stand against the government. The assumption the government will respond civilly to a confrontation is incorrect. I think we all knew that anyway.
The driver who has been saying LaVoy charged the cops is a complete liar as per the video and everything else he says should be discarded, there is good reason to question what side he was on now.
One thing the film doesn't say is when did the cops start shooting; did the 18 year old there say it was when LaVoy was still in the vehicle, could that had been when & why he sped off? Did the cops shoot at the first stop?
When LaVoy got out of vehicle he clearly had his hands up, question is was he fired at by the cops with his hands up? Was he armed? No weapon can be seen in the video on LaVoy, even if he was armed if someone was firing at you with your hands up would you go for your gun?
Finding out whether the cops were shooting at people before LaVoy got out of the SUV or when LaVoy had his hands up and if anyone on LaVoy side including LaVoy ever returned fire does play into whether this was murder or not; IMHO.
One other thing, there was so many times the cops could have taken down these people peacefully over the duration of this event, think about it, taking them down at this location was purely an ambush set up it appears with the clear intention of killing anyone who did not comply; IMHO.
Now we know the Rules of Engagement. Shoot first, and comply later, or not at all. The COWARDS are the CHICKENSHIT FBI, State Police, and Sheriff's department. The war has begun.
Many of the comments above mention that "this was a setup" as if the author is surprised by that. Folks, this was a setup from the moment it began! Actually, before it began. The Hammonds were setup long before the occupation at the refuge began. There is a lesson here. This entire group of people were doomed from the moment they decided to get involved with this. As stated previously: it was the wrong cause at the wrong time in the wrong place. There was NO WAY these people could be victorious. I'm as angry about what happened to Finnicum as the next guy and I am fully committed to taking a stand against the over-reach of this unconstitutional government - but people, wake up! This government does not and will not fight fairly. They aim to crush us and kill us and will resort to any measures to achieve their goal. This isn't a movie. Think about that as you plan your fight.
Just my personal opinions, but this entire occupation by the Bundy's and their compatriots was destined to fail from go. There was obviously very little or no reconnaissance of the area done beforehand, and little or no accumulation and stock piling of provisions. The location of the occupation was certainly not chosen with any military experience or intelligence considerations. Enough on that side of the confrontation.
The Feds and State Police, or whoever else was involved from LE, planned and deliberately set up the scenarios from the first road block on, and did it with malice aforethought to 'justify' their actions, whatever they might be. The placing of the 2nd road block on a blind curve was deliberate, to provoke the use of deadly force against the vehicle occupants no matter what they did. If they had crashed into the agents, fire at will. If they swerved to avoid a crash, they were attempting to escape. Fire at will. Same outcome either scenario.
The facts that the Feds and other LE scheme, plan and conspire against citizens are givens. That they lie, tamper with evidence and rehearse their responses to justify murders, is, or at least should be, common knowledge by now. That they have done it before and will again, should be a foregone conclusion.
What needs to happen in any future incidents like this, is that the citizens or patriots involved, have better vetting of those participating to eliminate infiltrators. More advance reconnaissance and planning is necessary, as is the gathering of all items that will be needed when things start. A lot more people are needed too. And if there are a lot of them that the Feds are unaware of, so much the better. Unknown 'reserve forces' that can join in when needed and surprise the 'bad guys' with LE, would be a plus. Copy their game plans and have people pre-positioned to surprise and eliminate them.
Contrary to some beliefs, this whole thing will not spark any large uprising by other citizens. They'll fume and fuss and decry the Feds murder/s, but there will be no retaliation of any kind against the perpetrators of this scheme to kill at least one participant of the occupation.
If you're going to deal with and go after 'terrorists' you have to be able to think like them, only do it first !!!
Something that seems to have slipped through the short term memory cracks; at what point, and how, was Ryan Bundy wounded? Maybe a foam rubber CS projectile that became hardened due to the cold temperature?
I have to ask - does anyone else see the object in the road behind one of the vehicles in the second roadblock? Facing the direction of the oncoming truck, it's the blocking vehicle on the left - behind the passenger side front wheel. It looks like a small ladder... Is it a device to reinforce the roadblock, or an elevated platform for a shooter?
Might be good info to have down the road... lots of other useful info in the video.
Perhaps a few people with relevant experience and/or training should study it and publish a report of their findings...
I have looked at the video and read all of the comments.
What is obvious to me in regard to that video is that this was a planned and executed ambush by police and other agencies? who knew exactly what they were planning to do.
I am assuming that the person killed was armed with a pistol and was wearing it as a side arm.
If that is the case, nobody, except a fool, just takes a pistol to a long arms fire fight and expects to live through it! So, was the victim not expecting a traffic stop by police?
And if that is the case, was he armed at all, and if he wasn't armed then why was he killed and why was he on that road if he had not been given some kind of all clear for him to do so by somebody in authority?
The strategic and moral advantage in this 'incident' was with those who stopped and then chased the victim and later as the deceased victim decided to flee, with those who had put up the road block.
Their strategic advantage was in the fire power they wielded, the number of officers engaged in that operation and the foreknowledge that this was a well planned event to capture the leaders of the 'rebel' group. Their 'moral' advantage was in 'lawfully' going about their duty in the knowledge that they had the full force of the law with which to cover their backsides should things turn ugly.
Will there be a coroner's inquest into this killing?
I hope so because there are many questions left unanswered so far.
"Why only one camera angle? The FBI knew how closely they were being watched here - I cannot believe there is only one angle on this event."
Come on. That's like asking where the front door went from Waco.
Incidentally, for those of us that can't figure it out, you put a road block on a curve in a road so that it can't be seen until it's too late to avoid it and it cannot be anticipated and therefore planned for.
Found the display interesting though. My but they seem to have lot of information that they don't want to share.... It would appear that the military only has about half the gadgets and information available to this aircraft.
This WAS murder under color of authority. It is being released so that you will see it and become scared and intimidated. Even more so when the involved agents/OSP officers are not charged and walk, yet again. Once again, with media complicity.
There cannot be any misconceptions about the intents of these personnel or their leaders or the politicians involved. They aren't going to fix this. They want this.
Oathkeepers and 3%ers could have prevented the murder of Levoy or at least done something about it after the fact. They both have now lost all credibility with me.
I am wondering about Oregaon law on one point. Where I live, if you are pulled over, even by a legit cop doing a legit stop for a legit reason, the person has the unquestionable right to drive to a place that is lit, that is a commons area where people are present. This action does not give a person a right to flee or get them out of the reason they are being stopped, but it cannot be held against them because they do it. Why? Because out in rural America, people have impersonated officers and there have been crimes committed against people who stopped only to have those crimes committed against them.
Is this the case in Oregon? As we know there was plenty of communication between leo and these folks, is it coming to light that these guys were together for the purpose of getting to the other sheriff, for the final resolution to be worked out? Is that why this hit had to take place now? That these fellas would not be returning to the compound itself and that it was about to be be over?
Was Lavoy being told to drop the weapons? And when he tried to do as told he was shot? Was he gutshot to make it look like he was reaching for a weapon? Of course there are more questions than answers, but it is clear that government wanted to do violence - and it did so. An execution was set up and an execution was executed.
My God, please help us. Please, please, help us help ourselves!
There's an 'American Experience' running on PBS the last week about Bonnie and Clyde. I watched it, as it turns out, the day all this happened in Oregon. It's toward the end of the program that ready sticks in my brain. The way the FBI had set things up to take the two down seems eerily similar to the way this happened. Don't know if that's SOP or just a coincidence. But if you watch the show I'm pretty sure they say the only reason that it had been set the way it was, was to execute Bonnie & Clyde. Just find it curious... maybe one of you guys here might too. As far as the ranters and ravers go about beating their chest and castigating the OK and 3%, I gotta figure maybe you should think rationally instead of emotionally (I know it's hard sometimes). Just a point of interest: I saw some stories on the news about car accidents before... best I can recollect, I've never seen a follow up story about the insurance companies.... Just a thought.
I have been in and out of hospital, being unable to see the full footage of this until now. Thank you Mike! The hardest part was watching after the person exiting the truck having been apparently immobilized, watching the critical 4 minutes elapse without any medical aid being offered to prevent brain death. There were enough footprints and snow machine tracks in the snow for me to surmise that this was a planned ambush stop location. If so, why was there no medical aid available to the downed person, or for the others in the area? The drone footage creates a lot of questions, for which I await the answers from responsible parties.
Someone made a very astute observation while watching the high def. "edited" video. Lavoy exits his truck with his hands up. 6 seconds later he drops his hands to the left side of his waist. At that exact moment you see to the right of the screen 2 LEOs one of which had his arm pointed at Lavoy and as soon as Lavoy reached for his waist, that LEO turns and runs into the road. A second later Lavoy raises his arm and points right at the LEO who was fleeing. As if to say "that guy shot me".
At that point, any LEO who might have been hesitant to shoot would no longer hesitate. It was over. The other LEO standing 10 feet in front of Lavoy, and the LEO behind him both shot him dead.
There was a video made at the refuge the next day by a man who wore the holster and 45 Colt revolver that Lavoy left behind to attend the meeting as a tribute to Lavoy. Lavoy didn't seem to be the type of guy who would have had a 9mm pistol in his left coat pocket as the FBI spokesman claimed. Just an observation.
Ladies & Gentlemen, one word of note, before posting here, Google suddenly required me to verify my recovery phone number and email, in case of "problems with my account". Someone is really interested in what this old guy is watching. It happen to anyone else?
My heart goes out to LaVoy's family. And I pray for his peace. He stood up for the principles he believed in, and he was murdered for it. In cold blood. You know it. I know it.
However, LeVoy won't be the last. I just hope he didn't die in vain. As for the government assassins, may they have to look over their shoulder from this day on.
Lots of partisan propaganda in the comments over this, but no clear evidence of any kind. I will note this; After trying to run a road block the FBI COULD have hosed down that car and shot everybody. The only person shot was a known militant with hundreds of published photos of himself armed. Who had repeatedly and publicly avowed to never be taken alive by federal agents. The FACT that no one in the SUV was shot while trying to run a road block at high speed, speaks volumes. This whole bru- ha and the nee jerk reaction of many in the "patriot" community has done more harm to the publics perception of "militia's" and "The III%" than any other act in history. This is not "WACO". ----Ray
I can't help but think why the feds would release this video so quickly. I don't think its because they are doing it to dispel rumors by a first hand witness to a crime of murder, I believe it's because a proper release with audio would give away the real truth; they shot LaVoy Finicum with his hands up. Period.
Anonymous poster above makes a very salient point about the use of deadly force for failure to stop. People should be sick and tired of being sick and tired of police turning every damn minor offense into a summary execution. It shocks the conscience.
I'll be in Oregon with other patriots. I hope I see you all there.
They did shower the car with bullets. Did you not see windows popping and snow kicking up around the car? The car was resisting arrest. The other occupants are lucky they weren't killed.
Rather than accusing others of propaganda, how about you come down to Oregon and demand a full inquiry? Or does that not change anything for you if he were to have been shot with his hands in the air?
Anon Ray at 6:17am....for someone who acknowledges that there's no clear evidence, you sure make a lot of assertions about what happened.
"...trying to run a roadblock...." Really? So it's not that the "roadblock" was positioned around a bend in the road where one's only choices (at posted speed limits considering conditions) would have been impact the vehicles making the roadblock or go off the road to avoid the impact?
"only person shot was a known militant with hundreds of published photos of himself armed"....so now the government gets to ignore due process because of *your* definition of a "militant" and published photos that one owns guns. Interesting.
"had repeatedly and publicly avowed to never be taken alive by federal agents"....to my knowledge, Lavoy said he'd rather be dead than live in a concrete box. I know few people who would disagree with that sentiment, especially since he was just trying to get government to live by the founding charter....guess they all should get shot down like a dog in a government ambush b/c they're version of a life worth living isn't the same as yours?
Initial reports say Ryan Bundy was shot too.... Maybe you should research your "facts" a little more and type a little less.
Watching the video at least a dozen times, I didn't see a sniper per se' -but I saw plenty of red lasers on LaVoy Finicum. (watch for bright red blinking dots when you watch the video another 5 or 6 times)
I had not been specifically searching for snipers in the released video, my focus on L.F. and the 2 cops closest to him in the FBI video instead. I did however, see a lot of laser activity -as well as 'painting' on snow & vehicle roofs -namely LF's Dodge 4x4...So where did those come from ???? Somebody had to be doing the "painting". If this was a simple "Traffic Stop" as is portrayed by the FBI and its complicit stooge 'media',.. - would those have been there? PRE-Meditation, eh? This entire hit was textbook Bonnie & Clyde, expanded with more firepower and 'personnel' Same evil, same deceit. Evil is nothing new in America...
I happened upon an identical Dodge truck last night and my 'unofficial' measure of the height of the grille to the ground is 30 inches. When LF's truck was stopped by the snowbank, you can just see the grille was just above the surface of the snow... that's a lot of snow. No wonder the truck came to a halt. A wonder really that those in the truck didn't get broken noses or whiplash from the sudden stop... I'm going to guess they must have hit it at between 50 and 60 (?) they must have been really shook up by the time it stopped,.. -and then, ....wow.
Listening to this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjA5CYYA6IQ last night, I heard it said that two shots hit the Finicum truck roof at the first road stop after they sat there for what? 3 minutes? -certainly giving damn good reason 'why' he 'fled' up the road -like gee,-to avoid being shot while sitting there on the road? And just maybe that was the INTENT all along ; to force him into the ambush ? Clues are within this video from the courthouse in Burns yesterday. Some of this amateur cellphone video is tough to follow and very boring, but there is GOOD INTEL to be found here if you listen… And better to have than nothing.
This entire event is so sad,… from the beginning to the end.
One thing all American's can take away from this is to NEVER 'trust" another government agent what-so-ever Our country is dying… I am so ashamed.
We must all DEMAND ALL videos, and audios from this entire incident be made very public. I smell many rats; again, listen to that video I provided here. Listen closely as the 2 fellows discuss: 'rubber or real bullets?' NOTE TOO: there's also mentioned to be two (2) cellphone videos that were supposedly running inside LF's truck during the entire incident,.. -that are at present at an unknown location... THEY MUST COME TO LIGHT. PRONTO.
Again this entire hit was textbook Bonnie & Clyde, expanded with more firepower and 'personnel' Same evil, same deceit.
Evil is nothing new in America...just more common.
It is obvious that most of you made up your minds about this long before it happened, so don't do anything like letting the facts or evidence get in the way. Most of you want this to be "murder" and will never see anything else. Further it is beyond evident that any voice that doesn't join your self perpetuating anti-"fed" circle jerk will be ridiculed then shouted down. You don't want truth or evidence, and are doing more to help Obama & Co. justify gun control and the patriot act than anyone on the left has in decades. I see lots of stupid, lots of rumor, lots and lots and LOTS of hate for the government and police. But I see nothing constructive or competent from any of you. Not a damn one of you seem to know what you are babbling about. You are being controlled thru your emotions and you are not the ones doing the controlling.---Ray
Why engage in ad hominem attacks? That's a sure fire way to be non-persuasive in any type of discussion.
Just in case there was a genuine curiosity in what you were saying about "most making up their minds", there's a simple reason to this. The FBI has a long standing tradition of bloodletting over any other type of peaceful/non-lethal conflict resolution process. Forgive me, as well as others, if we don't side with the FBI by default. THEY need to make their case they didn't just gun a man down in cold blood.
What they've presented so far isn't what I'd call clear and convincing evidence. There should be other video with audio available given the numerous officers present. Let's see the car. Let's see some other video footage angles with audio. Let's get the coroner's report. Let's see if Victoria's recollection of 6 shots is correct.
Ray, shut your cock holster. It's clear you've made up your mind as much as anyone else considering you stated things as FACT that are still up in the air:
1) Did Lavoy "try to run the roadblock" or simply avoid a collision around a blind curve.
2) More than just Lavoy was shot...Ryan Bundy was too apparently.
3)....well, what's the point? You're wrong and won't admit it.
Mark Koerber of the American Liberty Society and Free Capitalist.com just interviewed Shawna Cox who was released from Fed lockup in Portland. She was in Lavoy's truck sitting next to Victoria Sharp. She is much older than Victoria, so her account is more observant so she articulates in detail everything that happened and everything that was said in the truck from the moment they began to be followed, to Lavoy's death, and everything that happened after that. Including inside information. What she has to say is truly a bombshell. The audio is clear. Scroll down for the video. Interview begins at 12:30.
The FBI, men and women trained in tactical combat, hiding behind vehicles...for fear of their lives? Or was this just a show? Looks like a cold blooded murder and a lot of bs for the drone above. You suck.
LaVoy didn't carry his gun on his left side. Why did the FBI or whoever need to say he was known to carry on his left? His gun was left at the refuge. You don't get snipers in trees and up on the hill at regular traffic stops. Ryan was shot in the shoulder, he never left the truck. The video from Victoria's cell phone has now been released clearly letting you hear that there were more than 8 shots fired. You can find it on youtube running tandem with the fbi video.
63 comments:
The "edited" video shows the killing of Lavoy in all the detail of the unedited version. The big difference is that the "edited" video is available in 2 High Definition formats, 720 and 1080, so you can view in crystal clear detail.
Edited version linked below. Truck hits the snowbank at 5:50 mark.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjl1hefqqWI
Thank you for finding and posting this. Haven't been able to find the full video anywhere.
Soo... By FBI standards,
If i have a confrontation with a Individual and they Reach into/around/or near wear a Handgun maybe concealed...
I am free to use Lethal Force.
I shall remember that as a Potential Juror.
LaVoy Finicum Murder Video Footage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBNC-ZA9OKE
People will say what they will, mostly those who A) have no idea what any of this is about (in a general sense that government today is operating, unquestionably, outside its delegated authority and towards ends that are diametrically opposed to what was Declared and what is Constituted) and B) have never actually watched this video.
Here is the fact of the matter, people were PISSED OFF that Citizens dared stand firm in protest to the whole damn thing,that there IS NO remedy outside combining our rights together to get the attention to the fact that even when we are in the right, government refuses to RELENT and will rise to the level of outright murdering a Citizen who calls out their evil ways.
Agree or disagree about this being the right thing at the right time in the right place, Take Note - The United States Government just engaged in a planned, execution of a Citizen. They set up a roadblock on something of a curve and their intent was clear. Someone was going to die. And someone did. There had to be an example made, so other do not get the idea that this kind of thing would be tolerated.
They went so far as to have a guy jump in front of a vehicle to claim the ability to turn this into a shooting affair.
Say what you want but I know this to be absolutely true. There was NO REASON to shot that man. The plain truth is.....Government just committed intentional MURDER. And they will get away with it too.
They murdered that man. They murdered that man. They murdered that man.
So it occurs to me that since the fibbies put this out, they believe this video exonerates the crime.
I don't fucking think so. What complete and total douchenozzles! I am sure he was going for a gun, or something, yeah, that's it. LaVoy Finicum was murdered, right there, in front of all of us!
Pilate just washed his hands.
Tom 762
Well, relatively unedited.
Of the dozens of cameras there, this is the least incriminating video. That alone speaks volumes.
Bushwhackers 'n' backshooters...?
I'll tell you what this video tells me. It tells me just how important intel in the field is. In times of serious ( and I repeat, SERIOUS) armed contact with a bureaucracy, knowing where a roadblock is well ahead of an maneuver could change the outcome dramatically in times of all out civil war. I'm imagining two 4-man fire squads in each side of the woods well off the road lending a bit of surprise to the bureaucratic executioners before the dastardly deed. And also testing just how well armored a chopper tail rotor is or isn't. ( now watching that video would be a hoot!)...But back to the reality at hand - the Bundy's were led into this roadblock by forces looking to set them up for the fall. I find it hard to believe their planning could be this bad. If this really was just poor planning, then I'm glad I'm not part of any "militia" they're leading..
A grand jury will say that he reached for his waistband. Nothing to see here. Move along.
Do I smell burning fuse?
Video shows clearly, that the FBI did not have ANY reason to shoot Lavoy...The FBI Murdered him in Cold Blood to Try and make an example of him!
Also, why is there no ground footage video? Again, more proof the FBI Murdered Lavoy for no good reason!
We need sound. Were they shooting at him when his hands were up? I would go for my weapon if that were the case. If you are going to die anyway might as well take one with you.
All the corruption you are willing to accept and live with. If you think you are free, then why ....can you be executed by self justifying thugs?
I would ask again, are you FREE or just willing slaves to the criminal system ruling you, biding time until your privileges are REVOKED in their ENTIRETY?
Trial by FED GOV promoted execution....that's Progress I guess (sarc off)
Sign Me, Neal Jensen
Why only one camera angle? The FBI knew how closely they were being watched here - I cannot believe there is only one angle on this event. They chose the footage that they could fabricate a narrative about. Need a FOIA request and full investigation on this murder of a patriot. No more free Wacos!
Where is the body cam footage. You can't make a decent judgement of what happened from an airial video. Was he reaching for something or had he just been shot in the mid section? His hands were in the air and if any of us had just been shot we would have the same reaction to grab our belly where the bullet was. This video opens more questions not less.
Did he get shot before or after his hands dropped? He was clearly just tryi g to evade and didn't want to have a shootout. If he did he would have stopped and used his rifle. Sometimes excessive force and threat is what gets people killed. The FBI is at least guilty of that...
And why shoot at the vehicle? How many shots were fired? We are missing a HUGE amount of evidence with this video.
The first thing that is wrong with all of this is that it was as Mike said, from the beginning, the wrong place, and the wrong issue. The place was isolated and virtually "undefendable", the government could easily set up a "perimeter", and control it, and did! The two men had agreed to go back to jail and they specifically stated that they did NOT want this kind of help. That removed virtually any/all of it's "moral components" from being defendable......in the court of public opinion!
Many of us just knew that it was going to end more or less this way. In fact I am flabbergasted that the government did not kill everyone in the truck, as they would have defended it by saying the truck was trying to run one or more of them down, thus justifying the use of deadly force.
This incident was deliberately set up by the government, and from their point of view, it was a classic intercept and great way to end this in one fell swoop. The guys that occupied this place could not have been very smart as we have been saying since the start. The government had complete control over what happened here, from the beginning! First of all they had great intel. This intel told them that ALL the leadership of the group was going to be on the road, in 2 vehicles, travelling through very isolated wilderness in winter conditions and would have virtually no way to escape them on foot. The rest was easy. Setting the second road block up on a blind curve was excellent thinking, because it was blind, the terrain made it near impossible to get away on foot, and by being there, the occupiers would have had to RUN from the first stop thus giving the government a much more easily defendable reason for the use of deadly force, if need be!
Quite frankly it was insane to run from the first stop! When they did, they set in motion what happened at the last stop. When Finnicum got out of the truck he had his hands high in the air which was good. At some point he took both hands and reached down to his waist area and was shot. Some are saying maybe he was wounded and reach down to put his hands on that place. Maybe he did, but maybe he went for a gun. How will WE ever know the truth of that?
You can bet that we will NEVER Know the truth as the government controls ALL the evidence and will only release that which makes their case! I would like to see the autopsy report but know I won't most likely. I would like to see the results of a forensic examination of how many times he was wounded and in what order, but don't expect to see that either. When you fight by the government's rules you are almost defeated before you start.
The government should not own any more land then is necessary for government buildings and the like, and military bases. They own way too much now, and they use it against the citizens any time they can. It is subject to exploitation by those politically connected and many citizens have been abused for along time. This is a great issue to debate and argue about. But the way these guys went at this they were bound to lose from the start!
My dad taught me that you need to PICK your fights....and the PLACES for them....in order to have a chance to prevail. This was neither of those. I deeply regret the loss of life and am angry that the government set it up so that that would likely happen. But they have total control of the evidence and the information flow to the media. It is clear that public opinion was heavily against those guys who occupied the place, and was from the beginning.
Next time I hope those inclined to "make a stand" will pick a better "issue, time and place" and maybe the outcome will be much more to our liking!
WC
In the initial stop it appears there were two flashes (gunshots...?) immediately prior to LaVoy driving off...
Open disclosure and establishing the truth seems to require:
Release of video/audio of the initial 'traffic stop' of both vehicles
Clearer video would help
ALL other body or dash videos should be revealed
Audio is required in order to hear spoken words as well as gunfire/explosions
On another note:
Remember the film re-make of Manchurian Candidate with Denzel Washington?
At the end of the film one observes video of Washington's character being 'adjusted' to appear as someone else.
My question:
Has digital photography/video advanced to the point that created images are impossible-or extremely difficult-to detect as having been manipulated?
Not too many years ago, my business being partially the sale of industrial photo products, I remember manufacturers field reps saying that digital imagery was nearing the point of better resolution or quality than traditional silver films.
Two days-working 24hrs/day-would probably be enough time to 'adjust' imagery/audio in order to enable the fed.gov to control what the public sees and thereby steer public reaction in a favorable to fed.gov direction.
"LE f**ked up..."
No, they didn't. They did exactly what they wanted to do.
I totally agree with every sentiment here. I've reviewed this video 20 times..and frame by frame from 9:05 through 10:65 and here is what I see.
Observations. Contrary to what the FBI would have you believe by reports via their "analysis" and on ground statements of agents and Oregon State police...@9:13 it's BLINDINGLY OBVIOUS, the truck had just rounded a bend in the road only to find a roadblock approx 100 feet ahead, far shorter than he could have stopped at the speed he was going. No wonder he swerved. Any one in their right mind would have done the same. If you believe the FBI reports " he tried to go around the roadblock to escape", that is a bald faced lie. He tried to keep from being killed by driving the truck into a snowbank. He had NO CHOICE but to do what he did. Frankly, it's too bad he didn't crash. You KNOW why. Moreover..think what would be going through your mind at the instant the truck stopped. I know what I would be thinking. They intend on killing me. ...right here...right now. However, Finicum exited truck with both hands extended outwards. Not an aggressive act in my universe. It was only the moment when he must of realized..they were out to kill him, that he dropped his hands and turned. Why he turned I don't know. Maybe he heard the hidden agent coming out of the forest.
Furthermore, as far as I can surmise, whoever decided to place the roadblock in that exact location, was an bloody idiot. First off, he placed every single agent in jeopardy as anyone with one neuron between their ears could conclude a vehicle rounding that corner would not have time to stop. So, there was only TWO possible outcomes. (a)..he crashed directly into the roadblock..or (b), he crashes into the snowbank. There was NO WAY he could have gone around it. Even a moron can see that. Either way, agents could have been injured or killed, as the video clearly shows. This tells me something. Moreover, an agent clearly comes out of the forest with a weapon pointed. That tells me they had snipers off to either side. This was a setup. A trap. At a place where NO reporters or other video would have a chance to refute a story propagated by the Oregon State police/FBI. As it is, this video, as opposed to the FBI "analysis" of the video, is bullshit. You can't tell didley squat what Finicum was doing with his hands when he was shot.
Conclusion.
This was a trap intended to result in one of two scenarios, both of which were fully intended to kill one or more of the occupants. Hence snipers hidden behind trees to left side of vehicle, of which said sniper emerges and immediately shoots L in back.
All I know from viewing this video is the FBI lies through their teeth. They planned an execution. Period.
"'On at least two occasions, Finicum reaches his right hand toward a pocket on the left inside portion of his jacket. He did have a loaded 9 mm semiautomatic handgun in that pocket,' special agent Bretzing continued."
and how does bretzing know that? oh, that's right. according to victoria sharp, ryan payne got out of the car a minute or two earlier and was arrested before it took off hauling ass for this roadblock -- after he dodged a bullet! this "incredible" and "amazing" guy! ...who very likely reported to the people who paid him to be there who was in the car and what arms they had on them.
I would personally like to thank the Feds for posting a video showing "legal" ambush/assassination techniques.
Notes have been taken...
I wonder how they would feel if they were the ones squeezed in the middle.
Hummm...
So no sound because you'll hear FBI firing on the SUV ?
So far, the video looks like a green light for civil war to me.
If I had a younger brother, he would look like LaVoy
MikeH.
A Geriatric Threeper In Mourning
Deplorable monopoly of violence as usual ! The bought and paid for goons never had any pride ,integrity nor guts. This citizen was murdered pure and simple ! Behind enemy lines Ct.
In the original traffic stop, the truck was fired upon. At that point, Lavoy was under assault without cause, and was in defensive mode. He drove away not realizing there was a road block. He tried to make it around the road block likely because he assumed that was their best chance of not facing trigger happy feds. After getting his truck stuck, he quickly exited the truck with his hands up. Likely to lessen the chances of the passengers being struck by bullets. He walked clear of the truck with his hands up. Once he was squared up with the LEO who had drawn on him, he dropped his hand to his coat. It is likely that shots were already fired at him at that point because he was verbally aggressive. They could have been non lethal rounds of some sort, but he still would have heard the report of the weapons. Whether he was hit or not is irrelevant. If he had a 9mm in his pocket, now was the time for self defense. And if I am wrong and no projectiles whatsoever were fired until the moment he reached down to his hip, then it was definitely a suicidal act. And he should have known better than to give the LEO's a reason to start shooting b/c no matter how far from the truck he was, there was a chance the passengers would be fired upon. He also may have believed they would be all fired upon anyway, but as the leader he should have had a cool enough head to surrender completely unless fired upon, especially with a teenage girl in the vehicle.
We don't know if he reached for his coat before being fired upon.
Considering the times we live in, and the LEO mindset, it is honestly debatable and only audio will tell the story. Without bias, I believe it is more probable than not that he was fired on because he kept walking with his hands up being verbally aggressive.
Strange that the FBI press spokesman focuses on all the non lethal rounds that were used.
Why didn't they use non lethal to take down Lavoy? The first to approach him used lethal force without a doubt.
"Of the dozens of cameras there, this is the least incriminating video"
Exactly. We know what will happen when we stand against the government. The assumption the government will respond civilly to a confrontation is incorrect. I think we all knew that anyway.
Some observations;
The driver who has been saying LaVoy charged the cops is a complete liar as per the video and everything else he says should be discarded, there is good reason to question what side he was on now.
One thing the film doesn't say is when did the cops start shooting; did the 18 year old there say it was when LaVoy was still in the vehicle, could that had been when & why he sped off? Did the cops shoot at the first stop?
When LaVoy got out of vehicle he clearly had his hands up, question is was he fired at by the cops with his hands up? Was he armed? No weapon can be seen in the video on LaVoy, even if he was armed if someone was firing at you with your hands up would you go for your gun?
Finding out whether the cops were shooting at people before LaVoy got out of the SUV or when LaVoy had his hands up and if anyone on LaVoy side including LaVoy ever returned fire does play into whether this was murder or not; IMHO.
One other thing, there was so many times the cops could have taken down these people peacefully over the duration of this event, think about it, taking them down at this location was purely an ambush set up it appears with the clear intention of killing anyone who did not comply; IMHO.
Now we know the Rules of Engagement. Shoot first, and comply later, or not at all. The COWARDS are the CHICKENSHIT FBI, State Police, and Sheriff's department.
The war has begun.
Many of the comments above mention that "this was a setup" as if the author is surprised by that. Folks, this was a setup from the moment it began! Actually, before it began. The Hammonds were setup long before the occupation at the refuge began. There is a lesson here. This entire group of people were doomed from the moment they decided to get involved with this. As stated previously: it was the wrong cause at the wrong time in the wrong place. There was NO WAY these people could be victorious. I'm as angry about what happened to Finnicum as the next guy and I am fully committed to taking a stand against the over-reach of this unconstitutional government - but people, wake up! This government does not and will not fight fairly. They aim to crush us and kill us and will resort to any measures to achieve their goal. This isn't a movie. Think about that as you plan your fight.
Just my personal opinions, but this entire occupation by the Bundy's and their compatriots was destined to fail from go. There was obviously very little or no reconnaissance of the area done beforehand, and little or no accumulation and stock
piling of provisions. The location of the occupation was certainly not chosen with any military experience or intelligence considerations. Enough on that side of the
confrontation.
The Feds and State Police, or whoever else was involved from LE, planned and deliberately set up the scenarios from the first road block on, and did it with malice aforethought to 'justify' their actions, whatever they might be. The placing of the 2nd road block on a blind curve was deliberate, to provoke the use of deadly force against the vehicle occupants no matter what they did. If they had crashed into the agents, fire at will. If they swerved to avoid a crash, they were attempting to escape. Fire at will. Same outcome either scenario.
The facts that the Feds and other LE scheme, plan and conspire against citizens are
givens. That they lie, tamper with evidence and rehearse their responses to justify murders, is, or at least should be, common knowledge by now. That they have done it before and will again, should be a foregone conclusion.
What needs to happen in any future incidents like this, is that the citizens or patriots involved, have better vetting of those participating to eliminate infiltrators. More advance reconnaissance and planning is necessary, as is the gathering of all items that will be needed when things start. A lot more people are needed too. And if there are a lot of them that the Feds are unaware of, so much the better. Unknown 'reserve forces' that can join in when needed and surprise the
'bad guys' with LE, would be a plus. Copy their game plans and have people pre-positioned to surprise and eliminate them.
Contrary to some beliefs, this whole thing will not spark any large uprising by other citizens. They'll fume and fuss and decry the Feds murder/s, but there will be no retaliation of any kind against the perpetrators of this scheme to kill at least one participant of the occupation.
If you're going to deal with and go after 'terrorists' you have to be able to think like them, only do it first !!!
you can see the recoil from the handgun in the enhanced version,
cop fires five or six rounds in standard 1-shot per second fashion.
Finicum drop his hands after they started firing.
watch the cop by the black truck, he dives behind the truck as the handgun officer starts firing. Finicum finches a couple of seconds later.
Something that seems to have slipped through the short term memory cracks; at what point, and how, was Ryan Bundy wounded? Maybe a foam rubber CS projectile that became hardened due to the cold temperature?
MikeH.
Absolute cowardly fucking murdering bastards! 100 heads.
And I always thought the FBI were terrible marksman; what a terrific shot, from more than 40 inches.
This is the Fibbie to go visit Mrs. Clinton.
I have to ask - does anyone else see the object in the road behind one of the vehicles in the second roadblock? Facing the direction of the oncoming truck, it's the blocking vehicle on the left - behind the passenger side front wheel. It looks like a small ladder... Is it a device to reinforce the roadblock, or an elevated platform for a shooter?
Might be good info to have down the road... lots of other useful info in the video.
Perhaps a few people with relevant experience and/or training should study it and publish a report of their findings...
I have looked at the video and read all of the comments.
What is obvious to me in regard to that video is that this was a planned and executed ambush by police and other agencies? who knew exactly what they were planning to do.
I am assuming that the person killed was armed with a pistol and was wearing it as a side arm.
If that is the case, nobody, except a fool, just takes a pistol to a long arms fire fight and expects to live through it! So, was the victim not expecting a traffic stop by police?
And if that is the case, was he armed at all, and if he wasn't armed then why was he killed and why was he on that road if he had not been given some kind of all clear for him to do so by somebody in authority?
The strategic and moral advantage in this 'incident' was with those who stopped and then chased the victim and later as the deceased victim decided to flee, with those who had put up the road block.
Their strategic advantage was in the fire power they wielded, the number of officers engaged in that operation and the foreknowledge that this was a well planned event to capture the leaders of the 'rebel' group. Their 'moral' advantage was in 'lawfully' going about their duty in the knowledge that they had the full force of the law with which to cover their backsides should things turn ugly.
Will there be a coroner's inquest into this killing?
I hope so because there are many questions left unanswered so far.
"Why only one camera angle? The FBI knew how closely they were being watched here - I cannot believe there is only one angle on this event."
Come on. That's like asking where the front door went from Waco.
Incidentally, for those of us that can't figure it out, you put a road block on a curve in a road so that it can't be seen until it's too late to avoid it and it cannot be anticipated and therefore planned for.
Found the display interesting though. My but they seem to have lot of information that they don't want to share.... It would appear that the military only has about half the gadgets and information available to this aircraft.
This WAS murder under color of authority. It is being released so that you will see it and become scared and intimidated. Even more so when the involved agents/OSP officers are not charged and walk, yet again. Once again, with media complicity.
There cannot be any misconceptions about the intents of these personnel or their leaders or the politicians involved. They aren't going to fix this. They want this.
There is no mistake about what time it is.
Oathkeepers and 3%ers could have prevented the murder of Levoy or at least done something about it after the fact. They both have now lost all credibility with me.
I am wondering about Oregaon law on one point. Where I live, if you are pulled over, even by a legit cop doing a legit stop for a legit reason, the person has the unquestionable right to drive to a place that is lit, that is a commons area where people are present. This action does not give a person a right to flee or get them out of the reason they are being stopped, but it cannot be held against them because they do it. Why? Because out in rural America, people have impersonated officers and there have been crimes committed against people who stopped only to have those crimes committed against them.
Is this the case in Oregon? As we know there was plenty of communication between leo and these folks, is it coming to light that these guys were together for the purpose of getting to the other sheriff, for the final resolution to be worked out? Is that why this hit had to take place now? That these fellas would not be returning to the compound itself and that it was about to be be over?
Was Lavoy being told to drop the weapons? And when he tried to do as told he was shot? Was he gutshot to make it look like he was reaching for a weapon? Of course there are more questions than answers, but it is clear that government wanted to do violence - and it did so. An execution was set up and an execution was executed.
My God, please help us. Please, please, help us help ourselves!
Anon at 725pm
What did u do?
You have lost all credibility with me.
There's an 'American Experience' running on PBS the last week about Bonnie and Clyde. I watched it, as it turns out, the day all this happened in Oregon. It's toward the end of the program that ready sticks in my brain. The way the FBI had set things up to take the two down seems eerily similar to the way this happened. Don't know if that's SOP or just a coincidence. But if you watch the show I'm pretty sure they say the only reason that it had been set the way it was, was to execute Bonnie & Clyde. Just find it curious... maybe one of you guys here might too.
As far as the ranters and ravers go about beating their chest and castigating the OK and 3%, I gotta figure maybe you should think rationally instead of emotionally (I know it's hard sometimes).
Just a point of interest: I saw some stories on the news about car accidents before... best I can recollect, I've never seen a follow up story about the insurance companies.... Just a thought.
I have been in and out of hospital, being unable to see the full footage of this until now. Thank you Mike! The hardest part was watching after the person exiting the truck having been apparently immobilized, watching the critical 4 minutes elapse without any medical aid being offered to prevent brain death. There were enough footprints and snow machine tracks in the snow for me to surmise that this was a planned ambush stop location. If so, why was there no medical aid available to the downed person, or for the others in the area? The drone footage creates a lot of questions, for which I await the answers from responsible parties.
Someone made a very astute observation while watching the high def. "edited" video. Lavoy exits his truck with his hands up. 6 seconds later he drops his hands to the left side of his waist. At that exact moment you see to the right of the screen 2 LEOs one of which had his arm pointed at Lavoy and as soon as Lavoy reached for his waist, that LEO turns and runs into the road. A second later Lavoy raises his arm and points right at the LEO who was fleeing. As if to say "that guy shot me".
At that point, any LEO who might have been hesitant to shoot would no longer hesitate. It was over. The other LEO standing 10 feet in front of Lavoy, and the LEO behind him both shot him dead.
There was a video made at the refuge the next day by a man who wore the holster and 45 Colt revolver that Lavoy left behind to attend the meeting as a tribute to Lavoy. Lavoy didn't seem to be the type of guy who would have had a 9mm pistol in his left coat pocket as the FBI spokesman claimed. Just an observation.
Ladies & Gentlemen, one word of note, before posting here, Google suddenly required me to verify my recovery phone number and email, in case of "problems with my account". Someone is really interested in what this old guy is watching. It happen to anyone else?
To the How did Ryan get injured question -
Flash Ban Grenades come to mind.
My heart goes out to LaVoy's family. And I pray for his peace. He stood up for the principles he believed in, and he was murdered for it. In cold blood. You know it. I know it.
However, LeVoy won't be the last. I just hope he didn't die in vain. As for the government assassins, may they have to look over their shoulder from this day on.
Lots of partisan propaganda in the comments over this, but no clear evidence of any kind. I will note this; After trying to run a road block the FBI COULD have hosed down that car and shot everybody. The only person shot was a known militant with hundreds of published photos of himself armed. Who had repeatedly and publicly avowed to never be taken alive by federal agents. The FACT that no one in the SUV was shot while trying to run a road block at high speed, speaks volumes. This whole bru- ha and the nee jerk reaction of many in the "patriot" community has done more harm to the publics perception of "militia's" and "The III%" than any other act in history. This is not "WACO". ----Ray
I can't help but think why the feds would release this video so quickly. I don't think its because they are doing it to dispel rumors by a first hand witness to a crime of murder, I believe it's because a proper release with audio would give away the real truth; they shot LaVoy Finicum with his hands up. Period.
Anonymous poster above makes a very salient point about the use of deadly force for failure to stop. People should be sick and tired of being sick and tired of police turning every damn minor offense into a summary execution. It shocks the conscience.
I'll be in Oregon with other patriots. I hope I see you all there.
To Anonymous:6:17 am:
They did shower the car with bullets. Did you not see windows popping and snow kicking up around the car? The car was resisting arrest. The other occupants are lucky they weren't killed.
Rather than accusing others of propaganda, how about you come down to Oregon and demand a full inquiry? Or does that not change anything for you if he were to have been shot with his hands in the air?
Anon Ray at 6:17am....for someone who acknowledges that there's no clear evidence, you sure make a lot of assertions about what happened.
"...trying to run a roadblock...." Really? So it's not that the "roadblock" was positioned around a bend in the road where one's only choices (at posted speed limits considering conditions) would have been impact the vehicles making the roadblock or go off the road to avoid the impact?
"only person shot was a known militant with hundreds of published photos of himself armed"....so now the government gets to ignore due process because of *your* definition of a "militant" and published photos that one owns guns. Interesting.
"had repeatedly and publicly avowed to never be taken alive by federal agents"....to my knowledge, Lavoy said he'd rather be dead than live in a concrete box. I know few people who would disagree with that sentiment, especially since he was just trying to get government to live by the founding charter....guess they all should get shot down like a dog in a government ambush b/c they're version of a life worth living isn't the same as yours?
Initial reports say Ryan Bundy was shot too.... Maybe you should research your "facts" a little more and type a little less.
Uh...the folks at Waco had a whole armed stand-off and actually shot at the Feds, along with the whole end-times outlook and stuff.
If you're saying "it was just one guy, not Waco", then I get your point but simply disagree.
Watching the video at least a dozen times, I didn't see a sniper per se' -but I saw plenty of red lasers on LaVoy Finicum.
(watch for bright red blinking dots when you watch the video another 5 or 6 times)
I had not been specifically searching for snipers in the released video, my focus on L.F. and the 2 cops closest to him in the FBI video instead. I did however, see a lot of laser activity -as well as 'painting' on snow & vehicle roofs -namely LF's Dodge 4x4...So where did those come from ???? Somebody had to be doing the "painting". If this was a simple "Traffic Stop" as is portrayed by the FBI and its complicit stooge 'media',.. - would those have been there? PRE-Meditation, eh? This entire hit was textbook Bonnie & Clyde, expanded with more firepower and 'personnel' Same evil, same deceit. Evil is nothing new in America...
I happened upon an identical Dodge truck last night and my 'unofficial' measure of the height of the grille to the ground is 30 inches. When LF's truck was stopped by the snowbank, you can just see the grille was just above the surface of the snow... that's a lot of snow. No wonder the truck came to a halt. A wonder really that those in the truck didn't get broken noses or whiplash from the sudden stop... I'm going to guess they must have hit it at between 50 and 60 (?) they must have been really shook up by the time it stopped,.. -and then, ....wow.
Listening to this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjA5CYYA6IQ last night, I heard it said that two shots hit the Finicum truck roof at the first road stop after they sat there for what? 3 minutes? -certainly giving damn good reason 'why' he 'fled' up the road -like gee,-to avoid being shot while sitting there on the road? And just maybe that was the INTENT all along ; to force him into the ambush ? Clues are within this video from the courthouse in Burns yesterday. Some of this amateur cellphone video is tough to follow and very boring, but there is GOOD INTEL to be found here if you listen… And better to have than nothing.
This entire event is so sad,… from the beginning to the end.
One thing all American's can take away from this is to NEVER 'trust" another government agent what-so-ever
Our country is dying… I am so ashamed.
We must all DEMAND ALL videos, and audios from this entire incident be made very public. I smell many rats; again, listen to that video I provided here. Listen closely as the 2 fellows discuss: 'rubber or real bullets?' NOTE TOO: there's also mentioned to be two (2) cellphone videos that were supposedly running inside LF's truck during the entire incident,.. -that are at present at an unknown location... THEY MUST COME TO LIGHT. PRONTO.
Again this entire hit was textbook Bonnie & Clyde, expanded with more firepower and 'personnel' Same evil, same deceit.
Evil is nothing new in America...just more common.
It is obvious that most of you made up your minds about this long before it happened, so don't do anything like letting the facts or evidence get in the way. Most of you want this to be "murder" and will never see anything else. Further it is beyond evident that any voice that doesn't join your self perpetuating anti-"fed" circle jerk will be ridiculed then shouted down. You don't want truth or evidence, and are doing more to help Obama & Co. justify gun control and the patriot act than anyone on the left has in decades. I see lots of stupid, lots of rumor, lots and lots and LOTS of hate for the government and police. But I see nothing constructive or competent from any of you. Not a damn one of you seem to know what you are babbling about. You are being controlled thru your emotions and you are not the ones doing the controlling.---Ray
Anyone remember this paper....
http://smallwarsjournal.com/jrnl/art/full-spectrum-operations-in-the-homeland-a-“vision”-of-the-future
Wow, it's a relief to read a bunch of comments from people who can see truth. LaVoy was murdered. RIP
Anon Ray @ 8:58 -
Why engage in ad hominem attacks? That's a sure fire way to be non-persuasive in any type of discussion.
Just in case there was a genuine curiosity in what you were saying about "most making up their minds", there's a simple reason to this. The FBI has a long standing tradition of bloodletting over any other type of peaceful/non-lethal conflict resolution process. Forgive me, as well as others, if we don't side with the FBI by default. THEY need to make their case they didn't just gun a man down in cold blood.
What they've presented so far isn't what I'd call clear and convincing evidence. There should be other video with audio available given the numerous officers present. Let's see the car. Let's see some other video footage angles with audio. Let's get the coroner's report. Let's see if Victoria's recollection of 6 shots is correct.
The truth is not partisan. Let's get to it.
Ray, shut your cock holster. It's clear you've made up your mind as much as anyone else considering you stated things as FACT that are still up in the air:
1) Did Lavoy "try to run the roadblock" or simply avoid a collision around a blind curve.
2) More than just Lavoy was shot...Ryan Bundy was too apparently.
3)....well, what's the point? You're wrong and won't admit it.
Mark Koerber of the American Liberty Society and Free Capitalist.com just interviewed Shawna Cox who was released from Fed lockup in Portland. She was in Lavoy's truck sitting next to Victoria Sharp. She is much older than Victoria, so her account is more observant so she articulates in detail everything that happened and everything that was said in the truck from the moment they began to be followed, to Lavoy's death, and everything that happened after that. Including inside information. What she has to say is truly a bombshell. The audio is clear. Scroll down for the video. Interview begins at 12:30.
www.freecapitalist.com/2016/01/31/second-eyewitness-chronicling-the-tragic-ambush-and-murder-of-lavoy-finicum-video/
The FBI, men and women trained in tactical combat, hiding behind vehicles...for fear of their lives? Or was this just a show? Looks like a cold blooded murder and a lot of bs for the drone above. You suck.
LaVoy didn't carry his gun on his left side. Why did the FBI or whoever need to say he was known to carry on his left? His gun was left at the refuge. You don't get snipers in trees and up on the hill at regular traffic stops. Ryan was shot in the shoulder, he never left the truck. The video from Victoria's cell phone has now been released clearly letting you hear that there were more than 8 shots fired. You can find it on youtube running tandem with the fbi video.
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