Wednesday, January 2, 2013

More on the futility of gun prohibition, but how can we manufacture standard military magazines in clandestine workshops?

AR lower receivers made from wood and scrap metal.
But actually what I would like to see is how we can manufacture standard military magazines in clandestine workshops.

21 comments:

Independent minded common sensist said...

Check out http://defcad.org/ar-15-magazine/.

J. Croft said...

I wrote a solution I researched on building extended capacity magazines for bolt, lever and semi-auto rifles here: http://freedomguide.blogspot.com/2012/12/gun-shopping-2013.html

Anonymous said...

Stamped metal is easy. Make a die and bend it with a hydraulic press If you do the die right, it can make a left and right half, and cut them out of the sheet in 1 step. Do 2 halves, spot weld them together. Not hard at all. You can use epoxy,and make a follower out of fiberglass. Spring can be wound on a wood former. Floorplate is just a flat. Not difficult, I'd imagine.

Anonymous said...

Oh, in my earlier comment I forgot to mention how to make a sheet metal die easily. Use this:

http://www.eazall.com/kirksite

Sand cast the die. Use green casting sand, or make your own with very fine sand and motor oil - you can google how. Easier to make 2 dies, one for right half and one for left.

Anonymous said...

they did in packastan durring the soviet occupation of afganastan in small primitive shops

oh am a robot!

Anonymous said...

Before it's too late, Lindsay Books has published a series of books on making your own metalworking equipment, written by Dave Gingery. They include building a small lathe, milling machine, and other shop equipment from stuff you can scrounge from a scrapyard. Lindsay also publishes books about how to use those machines.

You may not be able to build your own machine shop in order to make your own magazines, but probably one of your friends will be able to. So, without drawing attention from all your neighbors by the delivery of large milling machines, lathes, sheet metal brakes, etc. you can make the equipment to make them. It would take longer to make then just buying machinery, but I suspect such an "amateur" machine shop would not be taken as seriously if inspected by authorities.

Unfortunately, Lindsay is retiring and closing his business within the next couple of months, so you need to get these books soon.

Besides, after the apocalyptical end of the world, after you've shot all the zombies, after you've got your farm going and growing enough food, you or your children are going to need his books to rebuild civilization. Seriously.

Anonymous said...

Shouldn't be too difficult.
Sheet metal.
Outer form.
Inner form.
Use a jack to press the sheet metal into the outer form.
Piano wire for springs ala SKS.
A little brazing.

Magazine.

If VC in the jungle using a hammer, scrap metal, wood fire and a scavenged barrel could make a single shot 1911 replica (held one of these in my hand yrs ago at a gun show) your average Joe should be able to turn out a magazine with one moving part in his shop.
No problemo.

Yank lll said...

The real Futility of gun prohibition comes not from the different materials weapons might be made from but rather it comes from the fact that the prohibitionist's probably wont live to see it survive... and rightly so.

Yank lll

Q. Fabius Pictor said...

Making magazines would require sheet metal stamping or plastic molding. Of the two, I think that plastic molding would be more discreet.

What I'd like to know is a good way to make barrels and bolts. I can't think of a way that doesn't necessitate a lathe and a mill.

But what I think we need most is good usable drawings of stuff like the Sten, PPSh 41, and other simple weapons circulated everywhere, in so many places that they could not be totally eliminated. We should also snatch up every copy of Chinn's "The Machine Gun" that we can.

They can eliminate objects (or try to) but they can't ban knowledge.

Anonymous said...

One answer to your question....."But actually what I would like to see is how we can manufacture standard military magazines in clandestine workshops.".....is to thermoform the parts from sheets of thermoplastic (or re-formable plastic). Thermoforming involves clamping a sheet on four sides and then heating the sheet above its softening point (where the sheet sags several inches below its cold, resting height after heating for a couple of minutes). After it sags properly, you force the sheet over a mold, apply a vacuum (shop vac will work), then blow air on the formed part to cool it. Only one half of a mag will be made so you'll have to glue (super glue is ok) the two halves together. Look this up on youtube. Suitable plastic sheet stock includes polycarbonate, acrylic, amorphous nylon, PET, etc. They won't look great but you can make them functional. If sheet stock is not available you can cut and heat polycarbonate water bottles, make a quasi-flat sheet from it, then heat a second time to form a part. This MIGHT be possible with 2 liter soda bottles but I doubt it. Let me know if I need to take the time to make a step by step guide with pics.

Anonymous said...

Within the last month or two I saw a video on how to make an AK-47 receiver using a bending brake and other forging tools. I would think that the thinner gage sheet metal would be easier to fold and would need a press or stamping device to place stiffening ridges to the sides of the magazine. The spring might be a bit of a problem however I was looking at a 90 rounder just yesterday and it uses a coil spring to push the ammo. That might be a bit more practical since the 90 rounder was injection molded plastic. The term necessity is the mother of invention and when needed good old Yankee Ingenuity will get the job done.

Anonymous said...

Making magazines is simple but time consuming if you do it by hand. You block them up in wood forms or metal forms, using any old piece of metal such as a car fender and a hammer.

I would image that one could be formed rather easily from melted down milk jugs, abs, pvc or combinations of those materials. They can also be printed with 3d printers and there are plans available on the net for free. Springs and followers are also easily made.

If a bunch of ignorant or perhaps not so ignorant tribesmen of afghani or Pakistani origins can manage it with hand tools, I'm sure most of us could do pretty well constructing, remote fire sams and counter measure defeating efps.

One additional point that is worth mentioning is that if this comes to a shoving match as it appears that it will, sams and efps, etc., will be the order of the day, not 223 and above.

Treaded said...

http://gunwatch.blogspot.com/2012/12/make-or-print-your-own-ar-15-magazines.html

There's a start. If the Pakis turn them out with sheet metal and a hammer along with some crude dies then it won't take long for legislatively inspired Americans to follow suite.

Anonymous said...

Thanks for the link to the printed magazine. I was going to suggest that, but it's cool to see it's been done already. I have a 3D printer, built from a kit for $700 -- built it with my daughter who was 10 at the time -- so it isn't hard to build one. She also has a 5 lb spool of pink ABS feed stock, so I think I'll print a magazine in pink :) (She prints her own doll-house furniture.)

The vacuum forming idea is pretty good too, and worth a try. Anybody with a shop vac and a kitchen oven is 3/4 of the way to having a vacuum former. PolyCarb is the way to go there. Soda jugs are PET-G which is probably not as good of a choice for mags. Plus, you can buy the polycarb stock in a sheet of the correct thickness to give you the desired finished size.

Another thought that comes to mind is epoxy casting resin. I would bet that resin casting would make a pretty good magazine half. Take apart one polymer mag. Use the halves as masters to make casting molds using RTV mold rubber. When the mold has cured, mix up epoxy casting resin and pour into the mold. You could easily make 1 mag case per mold set per hour that way.

Oh yes... the Gingery books... get'em, even if you never plan to build the projects. The know-how within is priceless.

Anonymous said...

Use a 3D printer to make the magazine case and follower. The springs are the easy part to make.

Michael Gilson said...

in re: rifling barrels without a lathe, could you build up the rifling with hard chrome? Have your central electrode wrapped with spiral non-conductors that are negatives of the grooves and when the chromium makes contact with the electrode and stops the plating process the chrome lined bore will have chrome lands.

Anonymous said...

Torrenting just search for cad files.

Wyn

jon said...

defcad.org are the people to pay attention to, like the other fellow said.

i believe this year will be the year of the practical, reliable 3d-printed firearm. it may not be semi-auto, and if it is it may not hold up beyond 5- or 10,000 rounds. but if you can print one in an hour for $0.15 and you get Q/A control from one piece to the next, that doesn't matter.

and to be practical, it only has to be printed on a machine that everyone can get for about $100 or $200, with easy instructions, with files obtainable online, that can be quickly understood and acted upon by anyone able to plug in a laserjet and run an installer CD. i believe this is in the cards as well.

Allen said...

molding using 2-liter soda bottles

http://youtu.be/Yvev6shNvSg

adding a 2nd bottle for extra strength

http://youtu.be/EFdgrJ-kyTE

I wonder if this process would work for making magazines, or reinforcing something made out of a weaker material. it looks like all it would take is a properly made metal positive to heat the plastic on, and a good coat of mold release.

maybe use the top end of a "post ban" (gag, hack) magazine, so you have the advantage of the stronger feed lips?

Anonymous said...

There are quite literally 10s of thousands of small family owned machine shops and sheetmetal shops all across the country. Anyone who thinks they won't be busy cranking out small arms and magazines is an idiot.

WE OUTNUMBER THEM!

Once the SHTF every paranoid Fed and bureaucrat will be demanding protection. There aren't enough Secret Service, FBI etc. to go around for for protection details never mind trying to police underground manufacturing.

Anonymous said...

You asked THE question and it looks like some good old Yankee Ingenuity came up with the answers. Time to fire up the old basement workshop.