Thursday, December 13, 2012

Praxis: The Rise, Fall and Rise of the M14.

No surprise that the M14-pattern is my own favorite weapon.


Anonymous said...

Being that I chose an M-1 Garand type 1 NM OVER the M-1a you could say that I strongly disagree with damn near all of that. I don't think that the M-14 "improved" the garand in any way. Box magazines are no benifit to a man who cannot replace them on a regular basis. The 7.62 NATO/.308 WIN. IS NOT better than the 30:06, its only newer (My M-1903mk1 will outshoot any rifle on earth. even my M-40a1OR my PALMA rifle.OR ether of my "F" class rifles. Its the best rife i'v ever owned)."Newer" or "more bells and whistles" DOSE NOT make a rife better,hitting the target does.

Anonymous said...

"Being that I chose an M-1 Garand type 1 NM OVER the M-1a you could say that I strongly disagree with damn near all of that."

Here we go. Now we're going to see a flame war about which rifle is a gnat's eyelash better than some other, missing the entire problem we face.

1. Far too many American's have their fat behinds rooted to the couch watching the latest "reality"

2. Far too many American's don't have so much as a Ruger 10/22 or more than a box of ammo to feed it.

3. Far too many American's that do have some kind of rifle couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with it, FROM THE INSIDE, much less be able to put lead on target in any kind of stressful environment.

4. Far too many American's can't envision any event that would cause them to fire on the troops of their own government like our ancestors did in 1775.

I don't give a rodents posterior if all you have to defend your liberty is a ragged out Chicom SKS, the day is coming when you will rue the day you didn't prepare better, AND IT WILL BE TOO LATE!


FG said...

Can you shoot with it? Can you actually HIT what you're aiming at? Do you know how to clean and PM your piece? Do you have enough working kit / parts / ammo to support your weapon? If the answer to ALL of the above is YES, then I don't care WHAT you've brought to the party. Welcome aboard.
When the CWII balloon actually goes up, you'll see every type of rifle ever made brought out of the attic. That means M1-As, ARs, AKs, SKS, Springfields, Lever Actions, and shotguns, too.
The time for gun snobbery is long past. We're all on the same side. Let's start acting (and training) like it. The clock is notched up at 2 minutes to midnight.

Californian behind the lines said...

Should have been "The sort-of-rise, fall, brief renaissance of necessity, and re-shelving of the M14."
At least that's a bit more accurate.
Consider: The rifle was fraught with production and QC/QA issues from the very beginning, wasn't even expected to be the pick (the T48/FAL was the presumed winner until some hand-fitted T44s squeaked an Arctic test win, and before that, they had to get John Garand out of retirement to get the design working at all!), and never even got to universal issue before being replaced by the M16. Heck, the troops of the Berlin garrison--the very front lines against the Soviets, the best of our best!--didn't get M14s until Kennedy personally ordered it done in the early 60s.
I used to work with an Army vet who used the M1 in Basic and then an M16 once he got to his unit.

So then, after we get into Afghanistan, the Army realized it needed a longer-range DMR solution.
What did they do? 2 things. First, got Knight's Armament and others working on a long-term solution (a 7.62 AR that would be familiar to the troops). Second, they dusted off M14s that were already in storage and paid for.
Now, with the M110s hitting the real world with a big splash at 3/4 the loaded weight and better mechanical accuracy, the M14s are going back into retirement...again. All the more so with the Compact Semi-Auto Sniper System, which looks to be essentially a slightly compact version of the M110 (reference here). And who can blame them? A "modernized" M14 weighs 14lbs, when complete with chassis system, optic, bipod, sling, and accessories--and that's unloaded! Add another 1-1.5lbs for a loaded magazine!
Compare that the the 9lb specified, unloaded weight of the CSASS, then add in the more familiar manual-of-arms, the better recoil system, simpler gas system, better mechanical accuracy potential, better optics mounting solution...

Simply, the M14 is a classic design. But its day was 1945. There are better designs out there now, at similar prices, doing the same job better, and more available to the average Joe.
The article is about 2 years out of date in its information, too. None of the "chassis systems" mentioned, nor the ammo, are any newer than about SHOT Show 2010 or 2011. The firearms world has been changing fast enough that the info is noticeably out of date.

All that said, FG has an excellent point.
Just because I know the M14 has yet again been eclipsed doesn't mean that I won't welcome a competent shooter with one when/if The Evil Day arrives.

Gunny G said...

M-1, M-14, zip gun, who gives a damn as long as they stand with US against THEM on THE DAY.

excitedVulcan said...

My Poly M14 is my fav. Though I like my Garand too. I do have boolits enough for both, as well as spare parts. I just can't seem to want an AR bad enough to cough up that much dough...

Semper Fi, 0321 said...

Interesting comments on the AR-10 platform by CalifbtL. You ever packed an M-14 or M-1? M-16? There was nothing wrong with the basic issue M-14 that needed another 5 lbs added on to make it work. Someone's new sales ploy to bilk the gov't out of more money.
Every single AR-10 I've seen in the hands of my friends ended up being sold within 6 months. They don't work! Boston T. Party was right in his Gun Bible; smoothest, sexiest, ergonomic .308 out there, and not worth a dime for reliability. They are the original jam-a-matic!
So you upgrade the gas system to a FAL style piston, charge $3,000 for it and everyone wants one. That's what I call progress.

LFMayor said...

I don't give a damn what you bring. Just be able and willing to use it or I'll give it someone who will.

MI-copperhead said...

Post by anonymous on December 13, 2012 10:26 AM nails it. You need to be able to hit what your shootin at. Go to an appleseed and get good training as well as good history.