tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post2970132650921680715..comments2024-02-28T20:56:23.768-06:00Comments on Sipsey Street Irregulars: "What does ammunition packaging have to do with the restoration of this Constitutional Republic?"Dutchman6http://www.blogger.com/profile/09935420042995679958noreply@blogger.comBlogger41125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-49464933627132038232009-08-12T14:22:19.014-05:002009-08-12T14:22:19.014-05:00COMMENTS ARE NOW CLOSED. THAT'S ENOUGH INSULT...COMMENTS ARE NOW CLOSED. THAT'S ENOUGH INSULTS FOR NOW. -- MBVDutchman6https://www.blogger.com/profile/09935420042995679958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-80417137452898261272009-08-12T13:37:26.663-05:002009-08-12T13:37:26.663-05:00Fortunately, I started buying a lot of ammo when i...Fortunately, I started buying a lot of ammo when it was still affordable. Even then, clips, mags and bandoleers were more expensive but i bought a bunch anyway and have about a third of my 308s in clips and most of those in bandoleers in clean .50cal ammo cans. Just waiting for the blue of their helmets before I start releasing the lead.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-76815981805851964592009-08-12T10:51:15.848-05:002009-08-12T10:51:15.848-05:00Theaton, I first heard the term, "In the rear...Theaton, I first heard the term, "In the rear with the gear", on the second day of a three day firefight, in answer to the question I made, "Where the f- is the First Sgt?" Somewhere in Cambodia, about forty miles west of the Parrots Beak, April,1970. Where were you, sportsfan?Seanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18410045398729979497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-10547019125497201572009-08-12T09:43:35.049-05:002009-08-12T09:43:35.049-05:00I have no beef with Mike. If you'll look back...I have no beef with Mike. If you'll look back at all the threads on KABA that attacked Mike, I've always posted something in support of him. I think the 7.62x64 article upset me because I feel that too many of us are focusing on the wrong thing at the wrong time. I simply asked a question. In Mikes answer he said that tactical packaging speaks to your willingness to fight. I disagree with that because I've seen many dressed the right way that lack the courage to back up the look. Drawing a line then stepping backwards to draw another line speaks to our willingness to fight. Expecting the current enemy to announce something formally speaks to our willingness to fight. Allowing Sixty-three plus years of Constitutional violations speaks to our willingness to fight. I agree that the enemy must start this. I'm just worried about how many times they have started it and we have done nothing. After I made a post in response to his answer the ad hominem attacks started, not from Mike but from others. Calling me a collector, target shooter or hunter without knowing anything about me calls into question your credibility. Saying that I said things that I never said completely destroys your credibility.<br /><br />theatonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-7131562281704040852009-08-12T09:06:10.432-05:002009-08-12T09:06:10.432-05:00Bobcat, please show me where I said that people sh...Bobcat, please show me where I said that people shouldn't be prepared. I've been prepared and preparing for years. This post had nothing to do with vac-packing. I agree with vac-packing. If you're just now worrying about how to fit 7.62x54R into a bandoleer that is not made for that round, you've missed the party. If you're not going to read my posts, don't comment about them. You look like Congress commenting on a bill that they haven't read. You guys will still be preparing when the restoration is complete.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-79457692261250437862009-08-12T08:31:46.667-05:002009-08-12T08:31:46.667-05:00Theaton really missed the big picture. While he r...Theaton really missed the big picture. While he rightfully is concerned about threats against the Republic, part of the picture is being prepared to defend not only it, but one's family and self. To that end, vac-packing ammo has a significant practical element to it as Mike points out: improving shelf life by keeping moisture and oxygen away from it. For example, any ammo that comes in cardboard boxes must be repackaged or stored in it's entirety in a tightly controlled environment(consistently cool and dry). Lacking the tightly controlled environment, many elect to vac-pack vulnerable ammo and place in ammo cans as part of this effort in simply being prudent with valued and vulnerable supplies. Ammo is not the only thing that should be vac-packed...<br /><br />It's that simple, both practical reasoning and considerate of the larger picture. <br /><br />BobcatAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-33606739873808172442009-08-12T06:02:20.406-05:002009-08-12T06:02:20.406-05:00Anonymous 7:31PM asks:
"What is the equivale...Anonymous 7:31PM asks:<br /><br />"What is the equivalent of stripper clips and bandoleers for the HK-91 magazines, which don't seem to accept a stripper clip guide that's small and light? Is that what the cheap surplus aluminum mags are for, just put everything in mags?"<br /><br />At last! A praxis question, and a good one too. And frankly I don't know the answer. I will forward it, however, to someone who will know.<br /><br />When I owned an HK91 as my MBR back in the early 80s, I cast around for some and came up empty. shortly after that I decided that the M14 design was better. I hated that the HK had no bolt hold-open and thus I had to put two tracers in the mag -- one five from the bottom and one next to the last. I resented the expense of the tracers. Funny. Oh, if I knew then what I know now!<br /><br />Anyway, I will find out and let you know.<br /><br />MikeDutchman6https://www.blogger.com/profile/09935420042995679958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-44380472566262883532009-08-12T02:39:27.635-05:002009-08-12T02:39:27.635-05:00First off, I want to say that, for some reason or ...First off, I want to say that, for some reason or another, this "debate" got WAY out of hand. I read Tony's (theaton's) comments on KABA pretty regularly. Tony, you have a lot of good things to say,...I enjoy and learn from your comments.<br /><br />Tony read MVB's post and took something different out of it than most other readers. Oh well. Maybe he has a some sort of beef with MVB. I dunno. That's his issue, or between them. Otherwise, I see validity in both sides of this (seemingly) silly argument. We are all on the same side here, I hope. We all have (and/or need) good information, advice, and opinions in regards to the current mess we are all facing in this country. All that being said, healthy debate amongst all of us like minded right-wing extremists is necessary and helpful.<br /><br />Mike, I agree with your good friends thoughts (in your post right above this one). I have one nit to pick, and one heavy concern.<br /><br />In the 3rd and 4th bullet of his 1st point..."when...the following occurs:...The opposition formally states..."<br /><br />My immediate thoughts are that, what if it never is "formal?" So what? They could INformally do those things or anything to a point where it takes the same effect as if it WAS formally stated. There are already tons of things that FEDGOV has done that are un-Constitutional. It seems to me that if we wait until it's "formal," well, it may be too late.<br /><br />And my concern is this: (refering to bullet 1 and 2 of the 1st point) Even though we all here claim to be ready for such events, I have trouble visualizing exactly how it happens. Coordination/link-up, chain of command issues, logistics. No matter how patriotic and determined we all may be, 25 or 75 or 350 or more unorganized patriots showing up from every corner of the country to react to another WACO or resist UN troops (or US troops) just isn't plausible to me without some semblance of organization.<br /><br />Just my two cents and concerns<br /><br />-JoseyWales3633@yahoo.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-45818609116283527572009-08-11T23:37:57.989-05:002009-08-11T23:37:57.989-05:00How many Ruby Ridges or Wacos does it take? How m...How many Ruby Ridges or Wacos does it take? How many Constitutional violations does it take? They will formally state that the Constitution doesn't matter after it is too late. Every time a Waco happens, we draw a line and say no more. Then the next one comes and we step backwards and draw another line. <br /><br />"The tree of Liberty needs to be watered from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson - no movie, real life.<br /><br />I train on Saturday and Sunday. I write my Congressmen weakly. I read websites daily to see what we and the enemy might be up to. <br /><br />As for economics, No I don't work for free. I work so that $40K of my hard earned money can go to taxes for those that don't work. I've been poor and I've been pretty well off. In each situation I was free. I don't love America because of money, I love it for Liberty and Freedom. Everything I do for the restoration of this Republic I do for free. In fact, I use 10% of my income to purchase firearms, ammunition and other gear for those less fortunate than myself. I don't recall George Washington trying to make money off the soldiers that were fighting for him. In fact, he used his own money to pay them.<br /><br />You can refuse to post my comments here but I will never shut up. <br />The discussions at KABA have all but dried up since registration. I imagine Mike had something to do with that since he can't stand people that don't do things exactly his way. You may think you only need friends to bs with, but we need all like minded people in this discussion, friends or not.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-59036335930605538272009-08-11T22:42:58.891-05:002009-08-11T22:42:58.891-05:00It is with a mild sense of amusement that I observ...It is with a mild sense of amusement that I observe the prattle of so many apparent self-styled experts who have never faced hostile fire or taken a life in combat, and who humble themselves to advise the rest of us as to our folly in choosing how to carry ammo. I am tempted to say, if you haven't been there, please stay in the 'theory' classroom rather than regale us with keen speculation formulated in a safe armchair. <br /><br />And if any reader finds the content of this excellent site to be boring or irrelevant, there is no requirement to remain, and there are plenty of Rambo-wannabe "Kill them All" blogs out there to peruse. the praxis entries are for passing on informaiton... it is that simple. Not every post on this blog is required to wave the flag and issue marching orders.<br /><br />Likewise, when anyone begins to wail and bemoan the lack of action on the part of IIIpers because no one has charged into a local armory or BATFU office, firing madly with their Tec-9 and reloading from a pocket full of loose, lint covered 9mm rounds... I would say again, if you haven't done more than anyone else, then please show us by your example, and we will follow you as we celebrate the victory of the free people of the USA once more.<br />Until then... yeah... 'in the rear with the gear' is a pretty neat phrase and it fits a lot of occasions.<br />I DO wonder how many of the trolls here are BATFU plants who pop up to create division / diversion.ParaPacemhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09331087479753793346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-5203720608824159602009-08-11T21:31:25.235-05:002009-08-11T21:31:25.235-05:00What is the equivalent of stripper clips and bando...What is the equivalent of stripper clips and bandoleers for the HK-91 magazines, which don't seem to accept a stripper clip guide that's small and light? Is that what the cheap surplus aluminum mags are for, just put everything in mags?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-17375303001135214352009-08-11T20:22:06.507-05:002009-08-11T20:22:06.507-05:00Anonymous 10:29 SEZ:
"Just when is this arme...Anonymous 10:29 SEZ:<br /><br />"Just when is this armed citizenry going to act? Do we wait until the politicians violate the Constitution? Do we wait until they spend us in to unrecoverable debt? Do we wait for the yellow stars on our clothes? Do we wait for the trains to take us to the camps? Do we wait until after the shower? Do we wait until the ovens are just almost hot enough? We are currently between the yellow stars and the train ride. How much longer do we wait? I'm fairly certain that I know the answer, but not many will admit it. The actual Three Percenters that fought and died for this country would be embarrassed that the current Three Percenters would dare to use that comparison. They didn't put up with near the crap that we have. Also, they didn't make and fly their flags for profit. They made and flow them in search of freedom and liberty."<br /><br />Not having time to answer this one today, I held it until 2200 hrs. In the mean time, I forwarded it to a good friend. This is what HE had to say, and although I wouldn't have put it quite this vehemently, I must say I agree with his points. -- MBV<br /><br />Here's something for an answer:<br /> <br />1. The armed citizenry must be ready to act when any one or a combination of the following occurs:<br /><br />The opposition (most likely a LEA (law enforcement agency)) draws first blood ala another WACO or similar incident.<br /> <br />The opposition brings UN troops (armed) onto US soil to police the population under the color of any excuse/reason, ie, H1N1, natural disaster, etc. <br /> <br />The opposition formally states they will not abide the limitations of the Constitution in the future.<br /> <br />The opposition formally states there will be a 'political union' between Canada, US, & Mexico.<br /><br />2. "Never get out of the boat unless you're willing to go all the way!" Martin Sheen - "Apocalypse Now" Right now, many people are just coming to understand how much of their liberty is at stake. We are using this time to train and organize while we still have a semblance of liberty. <br /><br />3. As to the stage of being between the 'yellow stars' and the train ride, you couldn't be more wrong. First, the Jews were disarmed, as were all Germans. Only after disarmament, when they couldn't do anything about it, were the Jews forced to wear yellow stars. We can still purchase ammo, guns, and train as much as we want. I'd suggest you spend more time training and less time bitching. <br /><br />3. As to the comments about the flags, under our economic system, products cost money. Are you going to donate the funds? Are you going to donate your time? Everything costs somebody something. Do you work for free? To produce the flags, patches, books, etc, that help folks animate their feelings about their country, a great deal of time and money are put into the endeavors. Rest assured, if war does come, you will see the 3 percent give till it hurts to those in need by the donation of their life's blood to pay the butcher's bill.<br /><br />Until then, how about cutting us some slack and having a big cup of "shut the f-ck up"? -- Thomas A. HawkeDutchman6https://www.blogger.com/profile/09935420042995679958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-10333445750156847812009-08-11T17:49:02.356-05:002009-08-11T17:49:02.356-05:00We obviously have a failure to communicate. The po...We obviously have a failure to communicate. The point, which I'm sure almost everyone understands, is that we have to be at least as prepared for battle as the people who will be shooting at us. Most of my bandos are filled with mags, those who don't have enough mags should carry whatever is the best thing they can get. If that's a box of 22 shells dumped in your pocket ok. Mike is just trying to give ideas that WILL save your life, that is if you plan to defend this Country instead of wait for others to do it. There are lots of web sites you can go to and argue AR or AK, 30 call or 556. This is not that web site. This is a site for friends to discuss anything that will help us achieve our goals and keep our family safe. If you don't want a damn bandoleer don't carry them. If you have a better idea lets hear it. I'm sure we would all appreciate hearing from those who have a better idea.<br /><br />WeaverWeaverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05570277329224724358noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-21671881788723149312009-08-11T16:57:35.081-05:002009-08-11T16:57:35.081-05:00Piss, moan...piss, moan...
The principle is resup...Piss, moan...piss, moan...<br /><br />The principle is resupply in a Maneuver Warfare world as opposed to Attrition Warfare supply lines...<br /><br />Bandoleers, while not being the end all, be all, help riflemen move toward that objective.<br /><br />Sheesh.<br /><br />If most here were to look at the message rather than pick at the nits, we just might get some folks moving in the right direction.<br /><br />Is everyone going to do things the same way?<br /><br />No.<br /><br />Is everyone going to have the same method?<br /><br />No.<br /><br />Do what you think will work, and experience will tell you what works and what doesn't....provided you survive the first die off.<br /><br />Now...next subject.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-44095286400115493952009-08-11T16:01:58.483-05:002009-08-11T16:01:58.483-05:00You will not find it difficult to prove that battl...You will not find it difficult to prove that battles, campaigns, and even wars have been won or lost primarily because of logistics.-- General Dwight D. Eisenhower<br /><br />Ammo caching is not an exciting topic, but excitement is precisely what you want to avoid if and when the shooting starts.<br /><br />The better you prepare now, the better you can focus on the object at hand later, which is defeat of the enemy. <br /><br />Put up all the bullets, beans and bandages you can afford to store.<br /><br />Robert E. Lee explained his surrender as being brought about not from a lack of arms or the will to fight on, but from the troops' suffering resulting from a diet of "parched corn".<br /><br />Unforeseen eventualities will provide ample opportunities to lose this fight. Try to avoid succumbing to an ignominious loss by attrition. Logistics is one of the few elements of warfare over which any one of us has control.<br /><br />MALTHUSAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-28208871423112363842009-08-11T15:34:03.097-05:002009-08-11T15:34:03.097-05:00Bottom line, you can never have enough ammo, and i...Bottom line, you can never have enough ammo, and if you got it, it had better be ready to go or it may as well not be there.<br /><br />As for hard-headed disciplined killers, I'm with Sean on that (ex Cav Scout). The killers are the ones that get the job done, and far from getting good soldiers killed, they're the ones that save lives by pushing their troops to be prepared.<br /><br />Stick me with them when the balloon goes up.<br /><br />BoarHawgAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-26706790424116044602009-08-11T15:00:20.848-05:002009-08-11T15:00:20.848-05:00Mike,
You may want to clarify that folks should ...Mike, <br /><br />You may want to clarify that folks should have mags in a ready mag pouch system of some kind - vest, LBE, over shoulder bag, or even bandos modified for mags, THEN bandoleers with rounds on strippers and with chargers for resupply (and I would carry at least one bando on the body, as you may have to dump that ruck post haste!). and then a couple more in the ruck.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-2436050102124612082009-08-11T14:39:28.669-05:002009-08-11T14:39:28.669-05:00Bandos are a good way to carry spare ammo for your...Bandos are a good way to carry spare ammo for your mags. <br /><br />But don't you also need to have a loader, to make it fast to load up your mags from those stripper clips? Be sure to remind folks about that, and if you know good sources for loaders for various mags, (AR, M14, G-3, FAL) let us know. <br /><br />Also, if you hear of good sources for real deal .556 steel core ammo.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-43020964311027526372009-08-11T14:29:45.852-05:002009-08-11T14:29:45.852-05:00I think the whole point of the bandoleer thing was...I think the whole point of the bandoleer thing was to get the ammo out of those &%@#*%^ spam cans that take 3 hours to open and get it into SOME form of combat packaging. Mike just happened to find a bandoleer of comparable size to fit the x54R dragonbreath rounds into.<br /><br />Leaving all your ammo in bulk packaging that you can't get into doesn't say much for your personal readiness.<br /><br />Personally, I like the foodsaver idea.Crustyrustyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09478587825608882510noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-24178676315845908072009-08-11T14:03:36.428-05:002009-08-11T14:03:36.428-05:00parabarbarian
I started this. I questioned the l...parabarbarian<br /><br />I started this. I questioned the logic of worrying about a sewing project over worrying about the restoration of the Republic.<br /><br />I'm glad I did, I've obtained a whole new perspective of the types of people that seem to consider themselves 3pers.<br /><br />theatonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-57659695037908776882009-08-11T13:59:55.280-05:002009-08-11T13:59:55.280-05:00Soooo Tony,
You must be a hunter, target shooter ...<i>Soooo Tony,<br /><br />You must be a hunter, target shooter or collector.</i><br /><br />I'm none of these yet I'm also all of them.<br /><br /><i>I'll take a bandoleer full of mags...... </i><br /><br />You take that bandoleer full of mags ;) hehe haha. I'll take my method.<br /><br />theatonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-38885459391135447322009-08-11T13:46:14.444-05:002009-08-11T13:46:14.444-05:00I'd rather have it and not need it, then need ...I'd rather have it and not need it, then need it and not have it.<br /><br />B Woodman<br />IIIAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-46865912468499558012009-08-11T13:37:44.380-05:002009-08-11T13:37:44.380-05:00You posted some stuff on the Moisin Nagant. I have...You posted some stuff on the Moisin Nagant. I have that 7.62x54R for you here in the batcave, but that's as close as I'm getting to one. I prefer either a Mauser or an Enfield, yet we have folks criticizing the rifle and choice.<br /><br />Next, there's this thingie going on over bandoliers. Personally, I have 30 (plus spares) with various calibers loaded into them, so you know where I stand on the issue.<br /><br />So, what's going on here, folks? Is it that the prags have been keeping their opinions fairly quiet lately, so you're all aching for a flame war? You all need to remember that old saying:<br /><br />You dance with the girl what brung ya.<br /><br />In order to dance, you 1) need a 'girl', and 2) you need to feed her when she gets hungry.<br /><br />How you do this is up to you, but it needs to be done. I have yet to find "gungadin.com", and until I do, I have to carry sufficient ammo unto the task at hand. That means strippers/chargers loaded into bandoliers. As in 6 of them (300 rounds) are always sitting next to the already loaded rifle.<br /><br />I don't notice anyone getting cranky about spare magazine pouches for your sidearm. Same thing.thedweezenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-4293689712889907872009-08-11T13:36:04.159-05:002009-08-11T13:36:04.159-05:00A few points to The Trainer:
Failure to prepare y...A few points to The Trainer:<br /><br />Failure to prepare your ammo has nothing to do with a bandoleer. theaton didn't say anything about leaving the ammo unprepared. resupply also has nothing to do with a bandoleer. Your example is about bureaucracy.<br /><br />My father and four of his friends survived Viet-Nam without ever using a bandoleer. They didn't seem to have any problems feeding their firearms without bandoleers. They didn't loose their lives or property so the lack of a bandoleer <b>WILL NOT</b> cause loss of life or property. Wow, I can cause bold type too.<br /><br />I carry 600 rounds while training, 300 in magazines and 300 otherwise. I don't have a single bandoleer. I train with people that do and people that do. Other's use even a different method. Some that carry bandoleers can reload faster than I can and I can reload faster than some of them. Same for other methods. One size never fits all. Find what works for you and then train that way. Training is far more important than the method of carrying ammo. <br /><br />Some of the posts here make me worry about the quality and training the people will have when the time comes. If we have to many of these types, we are screwed. By types, I mean those that depend more on certain tools than they do training. Maybe they have bandoleers that magically load their weapons from them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7575061201749703300.post-5981192188271076772009-08-11T13:21:40.338-05:002009-08-11T13:21:40.338-05:00I don't see why the controversy. A bandoleer ...I don't see why the controversy. A bandoleer is just way to package ammunition for accessibility. Originally it was a wallet that a "musketeer" carried for his powder and shot. Later it was a belt, usually worn over the shoulder, with loops for individual cartridges. Now it is generally a light canvas bag with compartments for carrying magazines and/or ammunition in stripper clips or some other organizer.<br /><br />What's the big deal? Even a hunter usually carries extra rounds in a wallet or a pouch.<br /><br />I make mine from the nail aprons I buy at Home Depot or Lowes, A little hot glue, some small zip ties and rubber bands then -- viola! -- I have a cheap portable package for 80 rounds of 308 in 10 round strippers. I'm going to have to try out the Ziploc packaging.parabarbarianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04987535851654809713noreply@blogger.com